Some Bad Guy Love

[ShararatSharara]

I just had this fangirl moment over some villains of Fates. For the record, I really kind of fell hard for Iago. Sure he's a creep and a slimeball. But why I love him so much, for villain, is that he is a magic user, and he's just kind of cool and interesting. I can't shake off the connection to Aladdin with his name or even Othello for that matter, Iago being the ultimate villain name. Especially, the one who does all the scheming. I love his face and I love Excalibur. 

He, and Zola, who in birthright is quite interesting character. 

I mean, Garon and Hans are examples of stock characters with not much gradience to them. But Iago and Zola, they really make the game more interesting. It's like, how many twists can you expect? 

I almost want to go as far as to think Iago is ... hot? I mean, being an English literature graduate, any character of great English lit is going to just sit with me for a long time, hold a place of high reverance. 

Wish you could actually recruit Iago - but his soul is too tarnished like Garon and Hans to even be redeemable in anyway. 

He could get with some of the performing girls from Nestra or Macareth, though. I'd prefer to entertain Iago over nasty Garon any day. 

[MacLovin]

an Othello fan I see.

[Phazon Archon]

1 hour ago, ShararatSharara said:

Wish you could actually recruit Iago

"I'm afraid that's not possible"

I am usually a fan of magic-wielding antagonists (see Gharnef, Riev, Izuka, etc), and I am on the fence with Iago. I enjoy when a character tries to pull someone else's strings and generally act like a jerk who's barely out of everyone's reach (sucking up to the king helps). Alas, the writing made him stupid in a few places.
I would have preferred Treehouse kept the name Macbeth for him.

I like the design for Garon, but Fates' antagonists overall felt bland. I will admit I am much more accepting of "I'm evil because I'm evil" when the character in question can give me a display of magic.
Most consumers want some semblance of complexity in antagonists, which Fates all-but-fails to deliver on. Iago comes the closest with his one "what the hell??"  moment when he overhears Garon, but when the moment passes it ceases to matter for the rest of the story as Iago makes a full shift into giggle-and-make-you-suffer mode.

What I'm saying is I want to like Iago, but he's not good enough for me.

Edited January 22, 2018 by Phazon Archon

[ShararatSharara]

I just went gaga over Iago's staff savant - which of course sucks for you the player, making the level harder. but the concept just pwns.

[Dark Holy Elf]

Iago has a pretty good design and absolutely outstanding voice acting. Sadly he isn't much of a character, but to be honest that's par for the course for the Gharnef archetype. Warriors kinda drives this home; Validar and Gharnef exist only so that I can make fun of them, while Iago is actually legitimately fun to have on screen.

Garon's more of an obstacle than a character. The showdown with him in Birthright is an incredibly underwhelming finish to the game after the emotional high of Xander. In Conquest he's an effective enough obstacle but still just an obstacle, in Revelation he barely exists. It's a shame because I think Garon could have been a great character, and the story suffers significantly because he's the opposite of that.

Hans is your standard FE goon boss, I don't have much to say about him. One of the weaker ones because they never really give him his own unique traits to work with, compared with the likes of Valter/Caellach, Narcian, and Jarod.

Birthright!Zola is kinda interesting? I just wish they'd done more with him than a generic "show how evil the main villain is!" scene to finish it, though.

[ShararatSharara]

So I recently beat conquest, and I am playing Birthright currently, which I have to say the level difficulty is way too ridiculously easy - can this even qualify for a game to purchase off the shelf? My birthright is a DLC, since I bought conquest. Anyway, yeah I just am never a fan of the evil King character of the fire emblem series. I just find him too much of a ridiculous stock character with not much point to him besides he just is power hungry and that's it. there are so many more interesting nuances with the other characters and aspects of the game, such as sibling betrayals and what-not. I can see Iago being more of an ambitious character who wants more power and could have manipuleted the king to do so. 

besides the male characters who are fangirl eyecandy, i don't have much interest in the stereotypical macho evil male villain guy a la Hans and Garon. yeah, they are super strong, but they are also blockheads and kinda boring. Iago, being possibly somewhat more effeminate, appeals to me more. To the point that i might even find him attractive, if he weren't such a clown. 

Yeah, with Zola, I do wish there were more to him, because he doesn't try to make amends in conquest, but appears to do so in birthright, which i found was an interesting twist in the game. 

[Shadow Mir]

10 minutes ago, ShararatSharara said:

So I recently beat conquest, and I am playing Birthright currently, which I have to say the level difficulty is way too ridiculously easy

Of course Birthright's gonna look really easy coming off of Conquest... Anyway, just what difficulty are you playing?

1 hour ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

Hans is your standard FE goon boss, I don't have much to say about him. One of the weaker ones because they never really give him his own unique traits to work with, compared with the likes of Valter/Caellach, Narcian, and Jarod.

Funny that you happen to mention the Grado generals, since I'd say Caellach was little better than Hans was, and Valter is, well, Valter.

[Dark Holy Elf]

Caellach had the connection with Joshua, and his desire to be king. That feels like significantly more than Hans gets. Heck, even his scene with Aias (especially if you time that map out) is more than Hans gets as far as characterisation goes.

I'm not sure what you're getting at with Valter but he certainly has unique traits!

[Shadow Mir]

3 hours ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

Caellach had the connection with Joshua, and his desire to be king. That feels like significantly more than Hans gets. Heck, even his scene with Aias (especially if you time that map out) is more than Hans gets as far as characterisation goes.

I'm not sure what you're getting at with Valter but he certainly has unique traits!

The problem is that the connection to Joshua just isn't enough, and his desire to be king makes him more of a typical power-hungry villain... not unlike Hans, who's stated by the game to be "hungry for advancement and short on ethics". The Aias thing *really* doesn't do him any favours either, if you ask me... Overall, Caellach's whole shtick can be summed up as "I sure like killing, especially if I get something out of it". If he was supposed to be more, then IS failed miserably at that, and I'd honestly say Sacred Stones' quantity over quality approach to villains is to blame for this (10 villains in a game that's only 22 chapters long is a recipe for disaster, if you ask me)...

Like... What? If you mean to refer to the cursed lance thing, I'm not sure that it helps him, even if it makes him.

[Dark Holy Elf]

Valter has a creepy, rapey, obsessive desire to dominate his foes, particularly Eirika. If that didn't stand out to you you're the only person I've ever talked to about the character who feels that way.

That said I'm getting a sneaking suspicion you're in this conversation to whine about Sacred Stones rather than discuss the point I raised (which, might I remind you, is about Hans, not Valter or Caellach), or you'd have brought up traits Hans has that stand out.

[Shadow Mir]

6 hours ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

Valter has a creepy, rapey, obsessive desire to dominate his foes, particularly Eirika. If that didn't stand out to you you're the only person I've ever talked to about the character who feels that way.

That said I'm getting a sneaking suspicion you're in this conversation to whine about Sacred Stones rather than discuss the point I raised (which, might I remind you, is about Hans, not Valter or Caellach), or you'd have brought up traits Hans has that stand out.

Which I find pretty hard to remember because, well, more often than not, having Eirika face him is tempting fate (by which I mean risking seeing a Game Over screen thanks to Pierce making it a bad move to face him with anyone with less HP than he has attack).

I would've mentioned Hans's standout traits if I felt he had any notable ones, which I doubt he does. Well, other than being dumb as a sack of hammers (case in point: charging the heavily defended fortification in chapter 3. Also, threatening Corrin in front of the Nohrian royals in chapter 26... Which is bad enough, all things considered, but when two of them use divine weapons that have WTA over him, and making things worse for him, can attack him from range, meaning he can't do anything to them... Yeah).

[Dandy Druid]

I like Iago's design and voice, but sadly there isn't much to his character. Although I like him more than the others (Garon, Hans, and Zola). The Fates villains weren't as interesting as past villains. Maybe they had more going for them in the alleged "missing files".

[Etrurian emperor]

On 27-1-2018 at 2:39 PM, Levant Mir Celestia said:

The problem is that the connection to Joshua just isn't enough, and his desire to be king makes him more of a typical power-hungry villain... not unlike Hans, who's stated by the game to be "hungry for advancement and short on ethics". The Aias thing *really* doesn't do him any favours either, if you ask me... Overall, Caellach's whole shtick can be summed up as "I sure like killing, especially if I get something out of it". If he was supposed to be more, then IS failed miserably at that, and I'd honestly say Sacred Stones' quantity over quality approach to villains is to blame for this (10 villains in a game that's only 22 chapters long is a recipe for disaster, if you ask me)...

Like... What? If you mean to refer to the cursed lance thing, I'm not sure that it helps him, even if it makes him.

I don't think Caellach's motto is ''I sure like killing, especially if I can get something out of it'' but rather ''I'm completely fine with killing as long as I get something out of it'' 

I think there's a difference. Its not that Caellach feels particular enjoyment about killing but more that he got zero issues with it. Its worth noting he doesn't actually kill Joshua's mom before she made him and he did make it clear he'd let her live if she just worked along.  He's a rare fire emblem villain who isn't driven by bloodlust, loyalty or ideology but purely on what he himself can get out of it. I think it makes him stand out since we never had a purely ''rational'' villain before. 

Now there are definitely comparisons to be made between Caellach and Hans. Its like the writer of Fates thought he had a really interesting idea about a bandit working for the evil king in exchange for status but didn't know Fire emblem already had such a character but with some interesting traits to go with it. As a result Hans turned out as little more then the average bandit tutorial boss with more screentime while Ceallach got a more unique design, interaction with other character, an inferiority complex regarding his past 

As for Hans. The game may state he's merely ''short on ethics'' but the cutscenes seem to employ he gets off on killing just like Garon and Iago. 

[BrightBow]

13 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Which I find pretty hard to remember because, well, more often than not, having Eirika face him is tempting fate (by which I mean risking seeing a Game Over screen thanks to Pierce making it a bad move to face him with anyone with less HP than he has attack).

As if that trait only exists in that boss conversation. Come on, Valter really is not all that subtle.

“Ha ha… Eirika, eh? She’s a ripe little peach. And her brother, Ephraim… He’s better prey than I’d imagined. I can feel my blood rushing at the thought. This might be fun after all.”

“What are these cowardly mutterings? It is because you three generals are weak that we others must work so hard. And yet you get the honor of killing the girl. How I long to do your duty for you!”

“…I’ve found you, Eirika. Seems you’re as skilled as reports say. This is going to be fun. Yes, yes, yes. I do so love strong women.”

"I believe it’s time for me to return to my darling Eirika. It wouldn’t do for Glen to arrive before me, would it? "

"I’ve sent a gift your way, Eirika, but I trust you can handle it. You’re my girl after all. I need you to be strong for me… Heh heh… ha ha ha ha ha!”

“All you need to do is vanish, you disgusting old man. Eirika is mine. I won’t let you have her. She is so strong, so beautiful… She’s the prey I’ve dreamed of.”

 

Edited January 28, 2018 by BrightBow

[Shadow Mir]

10 hours ago, Etrurian emperor said:

I don't think Caellach's motto is ''I sure like killing, especially if I can get something out of it'' but rather ''I'm completely fine with killing as long as I get something out of it'' 

I think there's a difference. Its not that Caellach feels particular enjoyment about killing but more that he got zero issues with it. Its worth noting he doesn't actually kill Joshua's mom before she made him and he did make it clear he'd let her live if she just worked along.  He's a rare fire emblem villain who isn't driven by bloodlust, loyalty or ideology but purely on what he himself can get out of it. I think it makes him stand out since we never had a purely ''rational'' villain before. 

Now there are definitely comparisons to be made between Caellach and Hans. Its like the writer of Fates thought he had a really interesting idea about a bandit working for the evil king in exchange for status but didn't know Fire emblem already had such a character but with some interesting traits to go with it. As a result Hans turned out as little more then the average bandit tutorial boss with more screentime while Ceallach got a more unique design, interaction with other character, an inferiority complex regarding his past 

As for Hans. The game may state he's merely ''short on ethics'' but the cutscenes seem to employ he gets off on killing just like Garon and Iago. 

So maybe I was off in some aspects, but honestly, Caellach comes off as being extremely ruthless despite his initial willingness to let Ismaire live. Especially with his killing Aias if that chapter gets timed out, since there's no rhyme or reason to it. And I do agree that Hans seems to enjoy killing since that seems to be what all his battle intro lines revolve around.

8 hours ago, BrightBow said:

As if that trait only exists in that boss conversation. Come on, Valter really is not all that subtle.

“Ha ha… Eirika, eh? She’s a ripe little peach. And her brother, Ephraim… He’s better prey than I’d imagined. I can feel my blood rushing at the thought. This might be fun after all.”

“What are these cowardly mutterings? It is because you three generals are weak that we others must work so hard. And yet you get the honor of killing the girl. How I long to do your duty for you!”

“…I’ve found you, Eirika. Seems you’re as skilled as reports say. This is going to be fun. Yes, yes, yes. I do so love strong women.”

"I believe it’s time for me to return to my darling Eirika. It wouldn’t do for Glen to arrive before me, would it? "

"I’ve sent a gift your way, Eirika, but I trust you can handle it. You’re my girl after all. I need you to be strong for me… Heh heh… ha ha ha ha ha!”

“All you need to do is vanish, you disgusting old man. Eirika is mine. I won’t let you have her. She is so strong, so beautiful… She’s the prey I’ve dreamed of.”

 

So he was pretty obvious about it, but I only remember the bolded line and nothing else. I'd chalk it up to him being as forgettable as a Saturday morning cartoon villain.