Shaq-Fu A Legend Reborn

[Jedi]

We sure are seeing a lot of revivals and concept revivals aren't we.

[Ronnie]

That was still bad

[Zapp Branniglenn]

I'm not down with the marketing dissing on the original. Would a game that sucks appear at EVO?

Okay, it didn't appear at EVO, but I made you google it didn't I? Anyway I approve of the decision to make it a beat em up. The 3D platformers of last year have me confident that this genre revival can happen. All I need to do is make Sega hire me so I can direct Streets of Rage Mania.

[Jedi]

3 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

I'm not down with the marketing dissing on the original. Would a game that sucks appear at EVO?

Okay, it didn't appear at EVO, but I made you google it didn't I? Anyway I approve of the decision to make it a beat em up. The 3D platformers of last year have me confident that this genre revival can happen. All I need to do is make Sega hire me so I can direct Streets of Rage Mania.

I don't mind the direction of a Beat Em Up either, i'm always looking for more of em. 

[Ϲharlie]

That metal suit reminds me of Steel, another one of Shaq's failed endeavors.

Anyhow, I remember stumbling across an Indiegogo page for this years ago, but I never thought it would actually come to fruition.

[Zera]

30 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

Anyway I approve of the decision to make it a beat em up. The 3D platformers of last year have me confident that this genre revival can happen. All I need to do is make Sega hire me so I can direct Streets of Rage Mania.

Are you implying that beat 'em ups died? Haven't you played Guacamelee? Or Muramasa?

[Captain Karnage]

can't wait to make a drinking game out of this

[Ronnie]

26 minutes ago, Zera said:

Are you implying that beat 'em ups died? Haven't you played Guacamelee? Or Muramasa?

Basic/traditional beat em ups like Final Fight or Streets of Rage aren't really around. Last I can think of is Double Dragon Neon. Muramasa's labeled as an action RPG. Guacamelee counts though.

[Jedi]

49 minutes ago, Ronnie said:

Basic/traditional beat em ups like Final Fight or Streets of Rage aren't really around. Last I can think of is Double Dragon Neon. Muramasa's labeled as an action RPG. Guacamelee counts though.

Fight'n'Rage is also fairly recent. And is like the more old school variety.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

1 hour ago, Zera said:

Are you implying that beat 'em ups died? Haven't you played Guacamelee? Or Muramasa?

Guacamelee is a metroidvania. The combat system may feel like a Beat 'em Up/Fighting game but we're talking about a genre that is about fighting first and foremost. Most of your playtime in Guacamelee is using acquired abilities to traverse your environment like any platformer. I haven't played Muramasa but that's a nine year old game. And if it's anything like Odin Sphere, which I have played, I'd say that's action rpg. Not saying that RPG elements can't exist in a beat em up (even Double Dragon has an experience system that unlocks more moves), but a considerable amount of my time in Odin Sphere was spent crafting and grinding items in previous areas to get stronger rather than progressing through linear levels. 

32 minutes ago, Jedi said:

Fight'n'Rage is also fairly recent. And is like the more old school variety.

helloooo. Have to check this out later.

But yeah, one or two indie games on steam isn't what I'd call a genre revival. Because Indie game developers keep the lights on at night searching for nostalgic experiences to recreate. I want to see some big names come back. The 3D collectathon platformer wouldn't have "come back" with just A Hat In Time, Yooka Laylee, and Super Lucky's Tale. It needed Mario. And, y' know, one of those other three being a great game. Thank you, Hat in Time.

[Jedi]

3 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

Guacamelee is a metroidvania. The combat system may feel like a Beat 'em Up/Fighting game but we're talking about a genre that is about fighting first and foremost. Most of your playtime in Guacamelee is using acquired abilities to traverse your environment like any platformer. I haven't played Muramasa but that's a nine year old game. And if it's anything like Odin Sphere, which I have played, I'd say that's action rpg. Not saying that RPG elements can't exist in a beat em up (even Double Dragon has an experience system that unlocks more moves), but a considerable amount of my time in Odin Sphere was spent crafting and grinding items in previous areas to get stronger rather than progressing through linear levels. 

helloooo. Have to check this out later.

But yeah, one or two indie games on steam isn't what I'd call a genre revival. Because Indie game developers keep the lights on at night searching for nostalgic experiences to recreate. I want to see some big names come back. The 3D collectathon platformer wouldn't have "come back" with just A Hat In Time, Yooka Laylee, and Super Lucky's Tale. It needed Mario. And, y' know, one of those other three being a great game. Thank you, Hat in Time.

Yeah I wasn't saying its a sign the Beat Em Up genre is back, I just thought i'd mention it, I love the genre and I kinda wanna do a series on my youtube channel when I can figure out what I want to do with it called like "The Art of the Beat Em Up"

[Interdimensional Observer]

1 hour ago, Ronnie said:

Muramasa's labeled as an action RPG.

I've played it, and the RPG elements don't affect too much. Enemy levels scale with you, and I never noticed getting that much stronger just from leveling because of it. Making new weapons requires some killing and eating, but new weapons offer not so much extra attack, they do, but the horizontal boost of new battle arts is more significant.

 

13 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

And if it's anything like Odin Sphere, which I have played, I'd say that's action rpg. Not saying that RPG elements can't exist in a beat em up (even Double Dragon has an experience system that unlocks more moves), but a considerable amount of my time in Odin Sphere was spent crafting and grinding items in previous areas to get stronger rather than progressing through linear levels. 

Did you play PS2 OS or Odin Sphere: Leifthrasir for PS3/PS4? Because Leifthrasir massively overhauls the gameplay in favor of the Action side. Potions become more an accessory than a must for bosses, and food for leveling, well you can rack up enough ingredients in one go of a given area to get to a high enough level to tackle any boss no problem. Phozons can be used to upgrade Skills and unlock Abilities, but this isn't an end all be all. Then you have a super difficulty locked upon beating the game with the true ending once, which restricts your HP to its Level 1 no food base value (so you're 2HKO'ed at best), and possibly ups the AI's aggressiveness; Muramasa has a similar crazy difficulty setting too.

I really highly recommend Odin Sphere: Leifthrasir, I wish it got a PC port so more could play it. The gameplay is tight and varied with 5 PCs, the visuals beautiful, the music works, and the story I love. A little typical the story is, but for a game of 5 different tales, it never trips over itself surprisingly. It is admittedly repetitive because the areas and enemies repeat, and you can't choose the order in which you play as the characters. But the repetitiveness is less of an issue if you take a week's break or so between Books- save for Book 6- put a few good Healing Potions on everyone and maybe feed them a couple levels, but otherwise just do it right after Book 5 when you have an hour or two to dedicate to Book 6 and take in the grand finale.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

30 minutes ago, Jedi said:

Yeah I wasn't saying its a sign the Beat Em Up genre is back, I just thought i'd mention it, I love the genre and I kinda wanna do a series on my youtube channel when I can figure out what I want to do with it called like "The Art of the Beat Em Up"

The trouble with talking about this genre is it's a little hard to define in a post arcade world. For 3D games we tend to use "brawler" and "Hack n' Slash" as interchangeable terms depending on whether the player punches or swings a sword. Or failing that, they're just called "action games" and will probably blend all sorts of genres just to keep the gameplay feeling varied. God Hand feels like a very faithful interpretation of beat em ups in a 3D game, while God of War is what earned enough real acclaim and pretenders to be called an evolution of the genre. Notice how it relies on using fixed camera angles to always ensure the player knows which direction is forward for the next fight. Devil May Cry uses fixed camera angles as well, but I feel like that's just holdover level design philosophy when it was still a Resident Evil game during development. 

As for where the big names went, Streets of Rage 4/Streets of Rage 3D was rebranded as Fighting Force upon release, a finely average game that earned one very poor sequel. While Golden Axe returned in Golden Axe: Beast Rider, which I do not like. Final Fight got Final Fight:Streetwise and...oh shoot, that's in my backlog lol. But yeah, still critically panned.

4 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Did you play PS2 OS or Odin Sphere: Leifthrasir for PS3/PS4? Because Leifthrasir massively overhauls the gameplay in favor of the Action side. Potions become more an accessory than a must for bosses, and food for leveling, well you can rack up enough ingredients in one go of a given area to get to a high enough level to tackle any boss no problem. Phozons can be used to upgrade Skills and unlock Abilities, but this isn't an end all be all. Then you have a super difficulty locked upon beating the game with the true ending once, which restricts your HP to its Level 1 no food base value (so you're 2HKO'ed at best), and possibly ups the AI's aggressiveness; Muramasa has a similar crazy difficulty setting too.

I really highly recommend Odin Sphere: Leifthrasir, I wish it got a PC port so more could play it. The gameplay is tight and varied with 5 PCs, the visuals beautiful, the music works, and the story I love. A little typical the story is, but for a game of 5 different tales, it never trips over itself surprisingly. It is admittedly repetitive because the areas and enemies repeat, and you can't choose the order in which you play as the characters. But the repetitiveness is less of an issue if you take a week's break or so between Books- save for Book 6- put a few good Healing Potions on everyone and maybe feed them a couple levels, but otherwise just do it right after Book 5 when you have an hour or two to dedicate to Book 6 and take in the grand finale.

I have not played the remaster, no. I'm glad to hear the gameplay has some retooling as the original had a downright messy difficulty curve and incredibly un-balanced set of accessories and food items to craft. A Book's difficulty was very dependent on where in their story do they get access to the Pooka village for grinding HP.  And I can tell you the super difficult mode does exist in the original upon earning the true ending. I...probably won't take the opportunity to play the game again in the future. Most of my urge to finish the game was to see where this bizarre story was going. Most of the core gameplay infuriated me every step of the way. I can recommend the game to those interested, but I won't indulge in a revisit, once is enough.

Anyway, re-evaluating Odin Sphere, yeah I suppose I could consider it related to the beat em up genre. If my definition is loose enough to point to God of War, then this game isn't too much of a stretch in logic.

[Interdimensional Observer]

8 hours ago, Glennstavos said:

I have not played the remaster, no. I'm glad to hear the gameplay has some retooling as the original had a downright messy difficulty curve and incredibly un-balanced set of accessories and food items to craft.

Leifthrasir does give you a "Classic Mode" option if you want to relive the tedium, but you never need to play it at all. You can do everything in the improved one and ignore it like I did.

Here is a list of modifications/additions (it doesn't mention you get 3 Accessory slots though):

http://odinsphere.wikia.com/wiki/Odin_Sphere%3A_Leifthrasir

And here is a demo of Velvet in the new system, compare it with your old memories:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3MgV1LzQCk