Camilla Is Way To O.P.

[Shadow Mir]

7 hours ago, Ae†her said:

I thought Camilla was very well balanced with very high Atk and decent Spd, but she's not the best. She isn't the perfection that is Ryoma, but when paired up with Ryoma they both help each other out a lot, and eventually you get a bulky Camilla with very high Spd and High Atk, and decent Def and Res that lets you crush most units. However, the underlying problem for Camilla still persists even after proper support and skills, which is her vulnerability to Bows, even with Bowbreaker the RNG in Fates makes things crazy hard to avoid for sure. I'd say Camilla is the 5th best of the Hoshido and Nohr siblings after Ryoma, Xander, Corrin and Takumi.

To be frank, I think you give Takumi and (especially) Ryoma far more credit than they deserve. The former is an archer, which, while better in Fates, is still dragged down by the innate downsides of being such, and the latter is evade reliant in a game where durability is king.  

[Ae†her]

3 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

To be frank, I think you give Takumi and (especially) Ryoma far more credit than they deserve. The former is an archer, which, while better in Fates, is still dragged down by the innate downsides of being such, and the latter is evade reliant in a game where durability is king.  

I'm not giving Ryoma more credit than he deserves lol. I almost thought for a while that Xander was superior due to his ability to take virtually take no damage with the right supports, but in my most recent play through of Revelations Ryoma was able to handle hoards of enemies that Xander couldn't thanks to his higher Str, Spd, Avo, (survivable) mixed bulk and ability to proc Astra and specials better. I noticed this especially when trying to do Vanguard Dawn midway through the game without any My Castle Aid, Ryoma was the superior unit when compared to Xander because he was able to fly in (with Camilla's aid) and take care of mages and the like, and not to mention Avoid literally everything. Xander was more reliant at taking care of the hoard of physical units, and whenever he encountered a magical unit that was when he suffered, and it really showed the difference between these two units. I'm not saying Ryoma completely outclasses Xander, but an Avoid tank just has more utility than a physically beefy Paladin who can still reliably prevent doubles.

Takumi is also not that bad, and maybe tied with Camilla because Takumi is still one of the most amazing archers ever. He doesn't double like Camilla, but he can proc skills better, and if not that he can handle ranged units better thanks to his high Def, and he gets guaranteed hits more. Camilla basically can serve the opposite role of Takumi, which is to handle melee units  and magical units upclose, but has to avoid ranged units like Archers, Master Ninjas (avoid debuffs).

[SavageVolug]

Takumi can only take part in the battle on player phase. Meaning that on enemy phase it's going to be people like Camilla who are doing most of the work. And while Ryoma is better at dodging than the other myrms in Fates, if he gets hit it's going to hurt. I have seen Ryoma get hit when he should have dodged based on the hit chance and it hurts. Because Fates uses a system more similar to Single RNG relying on a unit dodging is generally a bad idea, I'm not entirely sure what the system is that Fates uses but I've heard that it's in between Single RNG and True Hit.

[joshcja]

Takumi has a +1 steel yumi going for him for 3 maps. Then he falls off hard and is the worst bow user in the game by a wide margin. Reina joins one map later, Azama is Azama, Xl10 Setsuna and Mozu out damage him on his join map in BR and he's a joke in Rev compared to units with similar join (Looking at you Shura/Camilia/Reina). Hell, Bowboro is objectively stronger than Archer!Taco on both routes.

Kiragi is really solid though.

Talismanstack!Xander is slightly better than VStack drop boosted Ryoma in Rev. They're both untouchable blenders but Xander has way better movement options.

Camilia is objectively better than all of these nerds though. Ignoring her other advantages... roses thorns is the second best personal in the game, with smart positioning she contributes more than Ryoma and Xander combined.

Edited February 17, 2018 by joshcja

[Shadow Mir]

8 hours ago, Ae†her said:

I'm not giving Ryoma more credit than he deserves lol. I almost thought for a while that Xander was superior due to his ability to take virtually take no damage with the right supports, but in my most recent play through of Revelations Ryoma was able to handle hoards of enemies that Xander couldn't thanks to his higher Str, Spd, Avo, (survivable) mixed bulk and ability to proc Astra and specials better. I noticed this especially when trying to do Vanguard Dawn midway through the game without any My Castle Aid, Ryoma was the superior unit when compared to Xander because he was able to fly in (with Camilla's aid) and take care of mages and the like, and not to mention Avoid literally everything. Xander was more reliant at taking care of the hoard of physical units, and whenever he encountered a magical unit that was when he suffered, and it really showed the difference between these two units. I'm not saying Ryoma completely outclasses Xander, but an Avoid tank just has more utility than a physically beefy Paladin who can still reliably prevent doubles.

Takumi is also not that bad, and maybe tied with Camilla because Takumi is still one of the most amazing archers ever. He doesn't double like Camilla, but he can proc skills better, and if not that he can handle ranged units better thanks to his high Def, and he gets guaranteed hits more. Camilla basically can serve the opposite role of Takumi, which is to handle melee units  and magical units upclose, but has to avoid ranged units like Archers, Master Ninjas (avoid debuffs).

Yes. You. Are. Or did you already forget that you called Ryoma "perfection"? Because here's some breaking news: Ryoma isn't perfection. You speak as though this is a game where you can rely on avoid tanking to make all your problems disappear. Unfortunately, it isn't. While it is true that Xander takes magic poorly, Ryoma takes any hit poorly. Also, Astra isn't exactly reliable.

The issue is that for the most part, Takumi can only contribute on player phase. And being "one of the most amazing archers ever" is hardly a feat worth boasting about when most archers are hot garbage...

Edited February 17, 2018 by Levant Mir Celestia

[Dark Holy Elf]

I'm not sure what Takumi does better than Camilla, aside from kill fliers. (As I've stated before, if Camilla's vulnerability to bows is deemed to outweigh the advantages of flight, you can seal her to a different class via an A+ or S support.) She starts substantially more powerful, and even when the latter has caught up, she has more power, more speed, more durability, can counter at 1 range (E-rank lances after promotion aside), gets access to L15 skills earlier, has a better personal skill, etc.

 

20 hours ago, Dunal said:

Wasn't really a fan of the Royals overall since they are basically the game being designed around using all of these units, which is an indirect way of lowering your deployment slots (otherwise you're low-key gimping yourself). Although I suppose that just goes for powerful units in general (like Mathilda, Orsin or Caeda etc..).

I dunno, I don't think any of the younger siblings are must-use units myself (though generally they're above average at worst). For the actually powerful ones... yeah, Camilla and Xander are largely similar to previous powerful units like Seth, Titania, and Haar. In all cases, you can bench them (Camilla in Unhappy Reunion aside), it just involves gimping yourself. But as long as some units are the best, that's gonna happen.

[Ae†her]

3 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Yes. You. Are. Or did you already forget that you called Ryoma "perfection"? Because here's some breaking news: Ryoma isn't perfection. You speak as though this is a game where you can rely on avoid tanking to make all your problems disappear. Unfortunately, it isn't. While it is true that Xander takes magic poorly, Ryoma takes any hit poorly. Also, Astra isn't exactly reliable.

The issue is that for the most part, Takumi can only contribute on player phase. And being "one of the most amazing archers ever" is hardly a feat worth boasting about when most archers are hot garbage...

Perfection was just me over exaggerating, no one unit is perfect in Fates. Avoid tanking isn't a hundred percent reliant, but it works out well for Ryoma, and like I said it's more than just avoid tanking that makes Ryoma great, it's about giving him the right supports so that he takes minimal damage when he fails to dodge attacks. Astra isn't very reliable, but it's not supposed to be something your reliant on, it's just a great offensive skill that if proced helps Ryoma build up his shield gauge. 

Archers still have their niche, but that's why I said Camilla and Takumi are tied because they both perform different things well. However, i failed to mention this, but Camilla can certainly do more than Takumi, and that's primarily because of her class and stats.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Base Ryoma have like 36/16 bulk which become 41/22 with Tonic and Rinkah PU and 41/20 with skills

 

Thats literally Camilla Tier bulk and in fact not much different to Scarlet. Unless you actually consider Camilla/Scarlet a Glass Cannon, Ryoma is actually tanky. Throwing in Astra and Vantage his average bulk is actually better than Camilla

 

 

 

 

Edited February 17, 2018 by JSND Alter Dragon Boner

[Shadow Mir]

20 hours ago, Ae†her said:

Perfection was just me over exaggerating, no one unit is perfect in Fates. Avoid tanking isn't a hundred percent reliant, but it works out well for Ryoma, and like I said it's more than just avoid tanking that makes Ryoma great, it's about giving him the right supports so that he takes minimal damage when he fails to dodge attacks. Astra isn't very reliable, but it's not supposed to be something your reliant on, it's just a great offensive skill that if proced helps Ryoma build up his shield gauge. 

Archers still have their niche, but that's why I said Camilla and Takumi are tied because they both perform different things well. However, i failed to mention this, but Camilla can certainly do more than Takumi, and that's primarily because of her class and stats.

Of course it was. Anyway, while it's true that avoid tanking isn't the only thing that Ryoma has going for him, there's also the part where Swordmaster is a mediocre class. Astra only results in a full shield gauge if all 5 hits go off. Guess what never happens, except against stuff he doesn't do too well against.

Fair enough, but I'd still say Takumi loses out.

17 hours ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

Base Ryoma have like 36/16 bulk which become 41/22 with Tonic and Rinkah PU and 41/20 with skills

 

Thats literally Camilla Tier bulk and in fact not much different to Scarlet. Unless you actually consider Camilla/Scarlet a Glass Cannon, Ryoma is actually tanky. Throwing in Astra and Vantage his average bulk is actually better than Camilla

Because everyone loves fielding a unit that's obviously hot garbage on Ryoma's behalf, right?

Astra's unreliable, as I stated earlier, and Vantage doesn't mean a damn unless you get lucky. Or get attacked by a unit that was weakened enough that they would die before attacking.

Edited February 18, 2018 by Levant Mir Celestia

[joshcja]

2 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Or get attacked by a unit that was weakened enough that they would die before attacking.

For a moment let's pretend the part where Ryoma somehow takes significant damage in BR/Rev. with open guage, fails to proc, and fails to crit, isn't a statistical anomoly or really garbo play by somone who refuses to pair up EP units.

----------------------------------------------

With Ryomas personal floor of +19 stack on EP the list of units weak enough to get instablicked by vantages reads as "All of them"

He's not the "Best" VLoD user but he is one and 100% killing things 100% of the time before they can interact with you is 100% safe.

(Holy shit. It's 2018 and somone still thinks Rinkah is bad.)

Edited February 18, 2018 by joshcja

[Etrurian emperor]

Camilla is definitely one of the best Fates units with great mobility, power, the ability to do an odd magic attack here and there and great availability in both Conquest and revelations. 

But I wouldn't call her overpowered. That severe bow allergy of hers is enough to make it so that mistakes with using Camilla can still result in a quick death. 

[Shadow Mir]

4 hours ago, joshcja said:

For a moment let's pretend the part where Ryoma somehow takes significant damage in BR/Rev. with open guage, fails to proc, and fails to crit, isn't a statistical anomoly or really garbo play by somone who refuses to pair up EP units.

----------------------------------------------

With Ryomas personal floor of +19 stack on EP the list of units weak enough to get instablicked by vantages reads as "All of them"

He's not the "Best" VLoD user but he is one and 100% killing things 100% of the time before they can interact with you is 100% safe.

(Holy shit. It's 2018 and somone still thinks Rinkah is bad.)

Because It isn't like Life and Death is a level 15 skill, right? Oh wait, it is. Or are you so forgetful that you fail to realize that other than a select few units, level 15 skills are gonna be irrelevant until you're near the end of the game? Because that's what it sounds like. So I don't give a fig what Ryoma can do with Life and Death, Swordfaire, and Vantage when the game's pretty much over by the time he has all of those.

And I'm not sure why you're surprised someone just dared diss Rinkah when she's bottom-of-the-barrel junk.

Edited February 18, 2018 by Levant Mir Celestia

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

9 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

 

Because everyone loves fielding a unit that's obviously hot garbage on Ryoma's behalf, right?

In a series where the optimal strategy since the first game is using as few unit as plausible nevermind in a game that specifically rewards the player for deploying worse units by making your best unit even stronger by doing so? 

 

Yes, i dont know why anyone wouldnt love that deal. Game is literally saying "Hey guys if you deploy 1 less unit you destroyed the entire game"

[Florete]

Iirc there are lance generals in Ryoma's join chapter in Rev that like 2HKO him or something. Dude's crazy in BR but I wouldn't even put him in top 5 in Rev (Camilla is, though). Still good, but definitely not dominating.

[Interdimensional Observer]

24 minutes ago, Florete said:

Iirc there are lance generals in Ryoma's join chapter in Rev that like 2HKO him or something. Dude's crazy in BR but I wouldn't even put him in top 5 in Rev (Camilla is, though). Still good, but definitely not dominating.

Well Scarlet is right therefor that fight, but you do address my part of core issue concerning Ryoma. He can Rajinto and dodge Axes and Bows well. Or he can grab the Dual Katana and dodge Lances and Shuriken well. Magic is rather inaccurate so he can always dodge that well. But Ryoma has issues wherever the opposite sides of the Weapon Triangle are mixed, since he can dodge one side well, but the other could seriously hurt him with good accuracy. Generals can and do pack both Lances and Axes- they will maul him one way or the other, he can't avoid this. Nor can he avoid Swords being consistently a bit too accurate against him.

Xander and Ryoma are similar in that they can tank, but they tank in different ways and with different weaknesses. Xander uses Def to tank anything physical, but is roasted by Magic, Ryoma can dodge Magic easily, but has the issues dodging the rest as I just listed above- he selectively and situationally can dodgetank.

[Shadow Mir]

3 hours ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

In a series where the optimal strategy since the first game is using as few unit as plausible nevermind in a game that specifically rewards the player for deploying worse units by making your best unit even stronger by doing so? 

 

Yes, i dont know why anyone wouldnt love that deal. Game is literally saying "Hey guys if you deploy 1 less unit you destroyed the entire game"

You couldn't tell I was obviously being sarcastic, could you... Anyway, that might've been true for other FE games, where exp didn't deteriorate that much (or at all, in the case of 1 and 3) for every level you were over a felled opponent. Fates throws that out the window, what with exp deterioration that's actually noticeable. In any other FE game, I'd still be leveling up fairly fast if I was 5 levels over my opponents, but in Fates, that's about the part where exp gain slows to a crawl. As for pairing up, it isn't as effective as it was in Awakening (skills like Heartseeker don't work if the unit with then is in the back of a pair up, you don't get a hit boost while paired up, and with how irritating ninjas can be... I consider that problematic).

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

3 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

You couldn't tell I was obviously being sarcastic, could you... Anyway, that might've been true for other FE games, where exp didn't deteriorate that much (or at all, in the case of 1 and 3) for every level you were over a felled opponent. Fates throws that out the window, what with exp deterioration that's actually noticeable. In any other FE game, I'd still be leveling up fairly fast if I was 5 levels over my opponents, but in Fates, that's about the part where exp gain slows to a crawl. As for pairing up, it isn't as effective as it was in Awakening (skills like Heartseeker don't work if the unit with then is in the back of a pair up, you don't get a hit boost while paired up, and with how irritating ninjas can be... I consider that problematic).

PU was toned down but its still very much ridiculously strong, Shield Gauge is super strong and getting +5 to a given stats out of nowhere is dumb. Theyre basically the reason people manage to make 0% runs a joke with steroid!Xander and steroid!Ryoma

 Its actually superbuffed in early game and strictly on stats bonus so thats something

 

Nevermind the fucking attack stance because if the stats bonus didnt convince anyone to use pair up that one will

[Shadow Mir]

8 hours ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

PU was toned down but its still very much ridiculously strong, Shield Gauge is super strong and getting +5 to a given stats out of nowhere is dumb. Theyre basically the reason people manage to make 0% runs a joke with steroid!Xander and steroid!Ryoma

 Its actually superbuffed in early game and strictly on stats bonus so thats something

 

Nevermind the fucking attack stance because if the stats bonus didnt convince anyone to use pair up that one will

Bold: You do realize that unlike in Awakening, pair up and attack stance are mutually exclusive (ergo, you can't use both at the same time - at least not without a skill that's unobtainable)?

Everything else: Sure, the shield gauge is helpful, but it isn't reliable (well, not in the sense of being able to block the attacks you want blocked).

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

4 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Bold: You do realize that unlike in Awakening, pair up and attack stance are mutually exclusive (ergo, you can't use both at the same time - at least not without a skill that's unobtainable)?

Everything else: Sure, the shield gauge is helpful, but it isn't reliable (well, not in the sense of being able to block the attacks you want blocked).

Guard Stance disables opposing attack stance. Thats actually one of the biggest reason to stay in Guard stance 24/7 in CQ

[Shadow Mir]

52 minutes ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

Guard Stance disables opposing attack stance. Thats actually one of the biggest reason to stay in Guard stance 24/7 in CQ

I know about that, but you leave me wondering wtf are you going to do against the likes of Kotaro and the foxes... most units would struggle to get even semi-respectable hit rates on the former if you exclusively used guard stance, and I've seen a lot of complaints on the latter as well.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

17 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

I know about that, but you leave me wondering wtf are you going to do against the likes of Kotaro and the foxes... most units would struggle to get even semi-respectable hit rates on the former if you exclusively used guard stance, and I've seen a lot of complaints on the latter as well.

Kotaro's level is basically a solofest on the right side with my other stuff playing cards in the corner in all my run so idk. First run i soloed with Odin, second run i soloed with Felicia. Third run Jakob solo. For the boss itself Odin one shot the first attempt, Felicia faces like 100% vs 5% hitrate or something, and for Jakob run just stack Heartseeker and Bronze Axe GG

 

Foxes is literally telegraphed to be soloed by Xander, so thats literally what i did. second run i just do Felicia solo because fuck playing that map, third run same shit just solo it with Jakob. The fact that they are 1 Range actually make terrain manipulation super easy. And theres other stuff like Beastkiller Mountain Kaze for this thing

[Shadow Mir]

On February 19, 2018 at 3:41 PM, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

Kotaro's level is basically a solofest on the right side with my other stuff playing cards in the corner in all my run so idk. First run i soloed with Odin, second run i soloed with Felicia. Third run Jakob solo. For the boss itself Odin one shot the first attempt, Felicia faces like 100% vs 5% hitrate or something, and for Jakob run just stack Heartseeker and Bronze Axe GG

 

Foxes is literally telegraphed to be soloed by Xander, so thats literally what i did. second run i just do Felicia solo because fuck playing that map, third run same shit just solo it with Jakob. The fact that they are 1 Range actually make terrain manipulation super easy. And theres other stuff like Beastkiller Mountain Kaze for this thing

My big issue is that in general, the other options for getting around high evade have issues (Freeze? Is limited, and liable to whiff, especially since Kotaro's on a throne which really dents the chance it'll hit. Heartseeker? Most units that innately have it are pretty spotty, and there's only one Calamity Gate. Solutions based on Heart Seal use are hampered by the limited number of them for most of the game).

I suppose that's a good idea, but there's the dependence on having a limited resource. Also, did you mean Hunter's Knife and not Beast Killer when mentioning Kaze? Not that I'd trust him when like two hits and he's dead as a dodo... Also, fwiw, they aren't restricted by forests, so I wonder what you mean by terrain manipulation.

[joshcja]

56 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

My big issue is that in general, the other options for getting around high evade have issues (Freeze? Is limited, and liable to whiff, especially since Kotaro's on a throne which really dents the chance it'll hit. Heartseeker? Most units that innately have it are pretty spotty, and there's only one Calamity Gate. Solutions based on Heart Seal use are hampered by the limited number of them for most of the game).

I suppose that's a good idea, but there's the dependence on having a limited resource. Also, did you mean Hunter's Knife and not Beast Killer when mentioning Kaze? Not that I'd trust him when like two hits and he's dead as a dodo... Also, fwiw, they aren't restricted by forests, so I wonder what you mean by terrain manipulation.

Ingnoring the bit where you get more seals and staves than you will ever need in CQ, and can trade weapons freely.... You get as many chances as you like to hit kotaro at 90%ish hitrate off the freeze stave's more potent users (You also get rally luck and skill by this point, for free). No inherent risk here.

As for 19 the terrain manipulation in question is flying over a mountain peak. You can just hover forever taking potshots if you like.

Heartseeker is pretty Gr8. When the roster of units with access to the skill before S supports reads Corrin/Odin/Niles/Camilia/every single child unit namely fucking Ophelia/etc... it's hard to call the list spotty. If that's still not enough for you (Generals only final destination) feirce mein stacks with HS and is... strapped to Benny.

If fsr you just hate all these things shoot him with a 20/5 mozu or if you hate Mozu use a fucksforsaken 20/5 Sniper!Effie off her free A+ with Mozu. Done, problem solved.

Fully buffed MN!Kaze with a bulk pairup on a mountain is about as buff as fully buffed Draco!Xander with a speed pairup. There are nominaly better options for wiping the map than either of those nerds but they certainly work and work reliably.

Edit: Guard guage is 100% manipulable and 100% reliable. It's an insanly powerful mechanic that the player has complete control over.

----------------------------------------------------

Rinkah is actually extremely good early game in BR, her bulk is huge and while her offenses are "low" naturally without any really viable stack options heated blood is a free +4 that lets her hit way harder than she has any right to. She eventually falls off but getting to 10/1 for promoted pairup boosts is free and boosts the shit out of any unit you strap her to.

Edited February 21, 2018 by joshcja

[Shadow Mir]

3 hours ago, joshcja said:

Ingnoring the bit where you get more seals and staves than you will ever need in CQ, and can trade weapons freely.... You get as many chances as you like to hit kotaro at 90%ish hitrate off the freeze stave's more potent users (You also get rally luck and skill by this point, for free). No inherent risk here.

As for 19 the terrain manipulation in question is flying over a mountain peak. You can just hover forever taking potshots if you like.

Heartseeker is pretty Gr8. When the roster of units with access to the skill before S supports reads Corrin/Odin/Niles/Camilia/every single child unit namely fucking Ophelia/etc... it's hard to call the list spotty. If that's still not enough for you (Generals only final destination) feirce mein stacks with HS and is... strapped to Benny.

If fsr you just hate all these things shoot him with a 20/5 mozu or if you hate Mozu use a fucksforsaken 20/5 Sniper!Effie off her free A+ with Mozu. Done, problem solved.

Fully buffed MN!Kaze with a bulk pairup on a mountain is about as buff as fully buffed Draco!Xander with a speed pairup. There are nominaly better options for wiping the map than either of those nerds but they certainly work and work reliably.

Edit: Guard guage is 100% manipulable and 100% reliable. It's an insanly powerful mechanic that the player has complete control over.

----------------------------------------------------

Rinkah is actually extremely good early game in BR, her bulk is huge and while her offenses are "low" naturally without any really viable stack options heated blood is a free +4 that lets her hit way harder than she has any right to. She eventually falls off but getting to 10/1 for promoted pairup boosts is free and boosts the shit out of any unit you strap her to.

5 Heart Seals, which you have until the level 3 shop, is *very* far from "more than you'll ever need", if you ask me... and how in the name of Anankos am I going to get Freeze to connect on a boss that (1) has high resistance, and (2) is on a throne, which is likely going to throw Freeze's accuracy down into questionable territory?? Especially noting that Elise's skill tends to be pretty spotty...Also, Rally Skill isn't likely to be obtained by that point unless you promoted early, and Rally Luck requires giving up a unit slot on a mook - No. Thank. You.

Okay, but there are some that I don't want getting anywhere I don't want them (namely, the quartet of Life and Death foxes near Kaden, with some less notable ones among them).

And out of those... Corrin, Camilla and Niles need precious heart seals (and the former might need more than that, whilst I'm just unimpressed by the latter, being overspecialized as he is). I'm also unimpressed by Odin.

You mean the completely unrealistic 20/5 Mozu (or Effie)? Because I don't start seeing level 5 skills until the chapter after, with certain exceptions.

I wouldn't trust Kaze - evade is far from reliable in most situations.

Of course you'd think that, because you're cocky and reckless. I'm not going to assume the AI will do exactly what I want it to do...

 

Rinkah stuff: Her "huge" bulk is compromised by her shit HP. And while Fiery Blood can help on the damage front, it can only do so much when said shit HP limits how much combat you can see in the first place...

[joshcja]

45 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

5 Heart Seals, which you have until the level 3 shop, is *very* far from "more than you'll ever need", if you ask me... and how in the name of Anankos am I going to get Freeze to connect on a boss that (1) has high resistance, and (2) is on a throne, which is likely going to throw Freeze's accuracy down into questionable territory?? Especially noting that Elise's skill tends to be pretty spotty...Also, Rally Skill isn't likely to be obtained by that point unless you promoted early, and Rally Luck requires giving up a unit slot on a mook - No. Thank. You.

Okay, but there are some that I don't want getting anywhere I don't want them (namely, the quartet of Life and Death foxes near Kaden, with some less notable ones among them).

And out of those... Corrin, Camilla and Niles need precious heart seals (and the former might need more than that, whilst I'm just unimpressed by the latter, being overspecialized as he is). I'm also unimpressed by Odin.

You mean the completely unrealistic 20/5 Mozu (or Effie)? Because I don't start seeing level 5 skills until the chapter after, with certain exceptions.

I wouldn't trust Kaze - evade is far from reliable in most situations.

Of course you'd think that, because you're cocky and reckless. I'm not going to assume the AI will do exactly what I want it to do...

 

Rinkah stuff: Her "huge" bulk is compromised by her shit HP. And while Fiery Blood can help on the damage front, it can only do so much when said shit HP limits how much combat you can see in the first place...

5 heart seals +Fren seals +partner seals is a fuckton of seals. Using all of them up over 13 chapters is a tall order.

Stave rank and skill boost stave acc more than mag. Stop being bad atthe game and you'll see 90% freeze as well. Seriously though I've tried to use every stave charge in the game for some meaningful gain. You can't. There's that many charges of freeze/enfeeble/entrap. No worries.

Sorry but... "I am levant, I complain about units dieing, I am unimpressed by a unit that cannot die. Ever". Pffft. Past that short list is short and off the top of me head. Absolute worst case you have Leo/Odin/Ophelia/Any other HS or Mein user ever to spread that sweet love around. So worst case 4 completely free units 3 of which are V!Sorc and one is Benny. Cry me a river over heartseekers limited pool of weak units.

Bow users can and will hit 20/5 in ch17. Shoot. through. the. wall. Bam.

Who the fuck mentioned evasion? Let any unit in your army hold a fat bitch like Corrin on a mountain with Elise/aurabot!Cammy riding an actual dragon on a peak behind em punching the rally button with a fat load of drugs and a filling meal shoved down their neck. Bam +20 def they're immortal now.

There is a broad well defined line between "reckless agression" and "the ability to count to 10". Guard guage needs only the later to be an abusable mechanic.

Hp tonics are good. You should use them sometime.

-------------------------

On topic I wonder if Cammys charecter design discussion looked anything like the Pubkeeper design discussions in Eo2+ where the only design consideration is just an arrow at the chest labled "huge".

Edited February 21, 2018 by joshcja