Thoughts on Romances in Video Games?

[Moblin Major General]

While it probably isn't believable necessarily, Bioware tries to make realistic relationships in their games, particularly Mass Effect. If any romance is to be believed, it would have to be the one between a fem!Shepard and Garrus. They might be two different species altogether, but both of them have gone through too much shit to care what anyone else thinks. Also, Garrus knows things no one else does, like the reason Shepard has PTSD nightmares, or if Shepard backstabs the Krogan.

[Magical CC]

Stop shoving Alisa to us, thanks a lot Cold Steel. Alisa is so lame, she is your standard tsundere with no redeem feature. Laura is manly, Emma is fluffy, Fie is loli and Mil is weird. They are way more interesting than Alisa. And the worse is no matter who you chose in 1, Alisa is still the main heroine! 

[DragonFlames]

On 20.2.2018 at 6:39 AM, Magical CC said:

Stop shoving Alisa to us, thanks a lot Cold Steel. Alisa is so lame, she is your standard tsundere with no redeem feature. Laura is manly, Emma is fluffy, Fie is loli and Mil is weird. They are way more interesting than Alisa. And the worse is no matter who you chose in 1, Alisa is still the main heroine! 

 

And apparently, your romance choice in 2 won't even matter when 3 rolls around, setting everything to zero again. *incohesive angry noises*

*cough*

Anyhoodle, I think romance in video games - as well as in novels, really - CAN work, IF the story goes through with it, as in, it doesn't just hint at romantic tension or have it so the protagonist is a dense idiot who doesn't notice the affections of others. There is NOTHING more frustrating than that. I hate, hate, HATE that trope, sorry every harem anime ever.
I also hate - as stated - if the game goes out of its way to HINT at a romance, but then it doesn't amount to anything.

Case in point: Digimon Story Cyber Sleuth: Hacker's Memory, between the protagonist and Erika

It should also do something for the characters if it's there, bonus points if it changes the ending you get as well. Stella Glow and Conception II: Children of the Seven Stars are shining examples of this, as well as the two Nights of Azure games. Not so much Persona, but those games at least try.
That is not to say I'm not a friend of the "tragic" romance, since that can also work well if it's done right.

 

See the two Nights of Azure games on how I think the tragic romance can be a good thing.

I'll also echo the sentiment of the romance (if it is there) having to be believable, though you could fit that into the "it has something to do for the characters involved" bracket, since these two things are connected to me.

In conclusion, I am of the opinion that - if you want to do romance in your game - either go all the way or don't do it at all. Half-assing it is just frustrating.
And if you give the player romance options, DO NOT imply "main" love interests (looking at you, Trails of Cold Steel and Fire Emblem Fates). Also, maybe have certain scenes change depending on who the player romanced, so it doesn't become weird (still looking at you, Fire Emblem Fates).

 

Edited February 25, 2018 by DragonFlames

[Slumber]

As an aside, I think there's a case for romance that comes COMPLETELY out of nowhere. 

Case in point: Dragon's Dogma

You can't tell me that a player getting the blacksmith in Gran Soren to be the one Grigori captures isn't some of the funniest shit in the world. Simply because a player might be so anti-social and beelining the game that the character they have the best relationship is the frumpy, short, middle aged blacksmith that they likely interact with more than anyone else is the one the big bad dragon is the one they perceive as their "true love". Many people might not even notice that there's a universal relation system in the game, and suddenly you make it to this climactic battle, and you and this random blacksmith are running for your lives so you can survive and live happily ever after. 

And then the scene at the campfire. My God. 

This was likely all played straight, but it can turn out so ridiculously, and the idea that the dragon is watching who you interact with and determining the one you most interact with is your "true love"... It almost feels like some meta-commentary on romance in gaming. 

Edited February 26, 2018 by Slumber

[Jotari]

5 hours ago, Slumber said:

As an aside, I think there's a case for romance that comes COMPLETELY out of nowhere. 

Case in point: Dragon's Dogma

You can't tell me that a player getting the blacksmith in Gran Soren to be the one Grigori captures isn't some of the funniest shit in the world. Simply because a player might be so anti-social and beelining the game that the character they have the best relationship is the frumpy, short, middle aged blacksmith that they likely interact with more than anyone else is the one the big bad dragon is the one they perceive as their "true love". Many people might not even notice that there's a universal relation system in the game, and suddenly you make it to this climactic battle, and you and this random blacksmith are running for your lives so you can survive and live happily ever after. 

And then the scene at the campfire. My God. 

This was likely all played straight, but it can turn out so ridiculously, and the idea that the dragon is watching who you interact with and determining the one you most interact with is your "true love"... It almost feels like some meta-commentary on romance in gaming. 

That reminds me of how completely monstrous you can treat the love interest in Chronological Cross without changing the plot. To quote TV tropes.

The player can have Serge treat Kid like crap, ignore her at every turn, leave her to die a slow death by poison, stab her in the chest, apparently use and manipulate her and then kill her again, and finally leave her in a coma reliving the single most traumatic day of her life, and she'll still be in love with a man she barely knows who already has a girlfriend. Her only mandatory interactions with Serge come from the manipulations of another character. Yet even after the ending of the game apparently presses the Reset Button on the entire series of events, she's apparently so in love with Serge that she will promise to find him and the game completely ignores the fact that, again, he already has a girlfriend. The game treats this as a cherished romance and there's even concept art depicting a married Serge and Kid. Bet there's going to be some really awkward stories to tell the children..

[Armagon]

18 hours ago, DragonFlames said:

Anyhoodle, I think romance in video games - as well as in novels, really - CAN work, IF the story goes through with it, as in, it doesn't just hint at romantic tension or have it so the protagonist is a dense idiot who doesn't notice the affections of others. There is NOTHING more frustrating than that.

I don't think having a dense protagonist in the romance is inherently a bad thing. Hell, i've met those kinds of people in real life. I think the dense protagonist trope is only bad if it's played up to ridiculous levels, which, to be fair, happens a lot. I mentioned it in my first post on this thread but Roy x Lilina is a good romance, even if Roy is dense as hell.

Of course, there is also a case to be made for comedies, since there, the dense levels are ridiculous but it's not meant to be taken seriously.

[DragonFlames]

2 hours ago, Armagon said:

I don't think having a dense protagonist in the romance is inherently a bad thing. Hell, i've met those kinds of people in real life. I think the dense protagonist trope is only bad if it's played up to ridiculous levels, which, to be fair, happens a lot. I mentioned it in my first post on this thread but Roy x Lilina is a good romance, even if Roy is dense as hell.

Of course, there is also a case to be made for comedies, since there, the dense levels are ridiculous but it's not meant to be taken seriously.

Comedies are their own thing, I think. If it's not meant to be taken seriously, then I have nothing against it.

The Roy x Lilina thing is a special case since it DOES amount to something in end if you - the player - want to, which is them being married if you get them their A-support, which is really easy to do. It actually "proves" my point about romance angles needing to go somewhere if the writers decide to put them in their works.
The way I see it, most games / stories make the protagonist dense so they can put a romance angle in and then don't need to have to do anything with it. Because, you know, evolving character relationships over the course of a story takes EFFORT. There are people that REALLY hate that concept, I hear.

It's like protagonists with amnesia: It can work when done well, but it's so overused and used wrongly at this point that it appears like the writers just wanted to pick the easy / lazy way out. In the "dense protagonist" case, it's also a safe way out for the writers as to not alienate their audience by having the protag straight out reject a person interested in them if they don't want the protagonist to hook up. It's a cop-out, is what I'm basically insinuating here.
But if a writer doesn't want to bind their protagonist to an intimate relationship, you know, because they are a traveler or a free spirit by nature or something like that *coughlikeinYscough*, they shouldn't even have the opportunity arise in the first place. It's the safest (and easiest) way to get out of that mine field for everyone involved; you're not angering anyone by being clear that there is zero romance to be had in your story and everyone will be on the same page, one or more of your characters won't be heartbroken by the end of the game / book, your protagonist won't look like someone's power fantasy by having a world-wide harem they can neglect without consequence (which people will loathe them for, I guarantee you *coughlikeinYscough*) and no one will complain about a romance angle being included just for the sake of it and then it doesn't go anywhere, thus it being half-assed.

Except for maybe those who expected romance but then found that there was none and then proceed to commence ye ol' shipping wars... but that's another beast entirely. 

And the "person likes protagonist, but protagonist is too dumb to notice" is the epitome of "not going anywhere" to me, as the relationship between these two characters stays that way until the end of the story. And that is boring as hell to me, as well as frustrating and probably unrealistic (I'm no expert on these things in real life, so don't quote me on that).
If there are exceptions to this, I certainly haven't seen them, at least.

Wow, got a bit ranty, there. But as an aspiring writer myself, this is one of those topics that are very near to what I'm dealing with while comprising a story, so I had a lot to say on the matter. What I say isn't the absolute truth, because of course it isn't, since such things are - like almost everything else in art - subjective, it's just my way of viewing this and my (most likely not conforming with the majority) standard I hold other romance angles to.

---
On another, semi-related note, I want to echo the sentiment of Bravely Second being weird about its romance subplot (though in my opinion, Yew and Magnolia actually worked well for what it was), especially concerning Edea. Nothing she said or did in the first game even subtly implied any romantic interest in Ringabel and in Bravely Second she turns into a weeping mess when confronted with the subject of possibly never meeting him again? What? 

 

The same holds true for Ringabel's other self, Alternis, by the way. Heck, she had way more scenes that may or may not have had her interested in Tiz or even Yew, for crying out loud. They were never anything more than childhood friends and any romantic interest (at least from the first game) was incredibly and quite obviously one sided.

Edited February 26, 2018 by DragonFlames

[Shoblongoo]

It enhances a story if its well written and believable in the context of the setting, and doesn't come across as forced or tropy or empty fan-service.

It detracts from the story if its poorly shoehorned in, or written so poorly that it feels more like a canonized fanfiction ship than a genuine human relationship. 

 

Edited February 26, 2018 by Shoblongoo

[Dragoncat]

On 2/18/2018 at 11:08 AM, omegaxis1 said:

No matter what situation there is, if there is a guy and girl somehow, there's always shippers.

There's shippers for two guys and/or two girls too. Yoai seems to be more popular than yuri, but yeah.

Alm x Celica was okay, but I felt it was incredibly cheesy and forced in the prologue. Like, come on. What ten year old makes promises of "being together forever"? I feel that it should have been more like Lion King, where Simba and Nala clearly cared for each other, but went "ew cooties" when romance was brought up.

I lowkey kinda ship Layle x Belle in Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: Crystal Bearers, although I don't see it going much farther than a quick fling with birth control use, they have sparks. I laughed for like 10 minutes when he told her she needed to go on a diet. That whole scene would have been a meh world building/backstory dump if she hadn't been there running around fangirling over the treasure. Which I know some people might roll their eyes and say she ruined it, but I like comic relief most of the time.

Most recently, Shulk x Fiora in Xenoblade 1 was done very well imo. That picnic scene, despite looking like he wasn't actually eating the sandwich because the modelers didn't put bites in it or anything, had everything needed to show romantic chemistry according to the article at Springhole.net on the subject. Warm, friendly expressions? Check. Eye contact? Check. Getting in each other's personal bubble? Check. I felt so bad for the poor boy for awhile there, he didn't laugh or smile for the longest time after she "died". Clearly he loved her and the feeling was mutual.

Ironically for both the above ships I feel have a chance of being fruitful, I headcanon twins, a boy and a girl. Alm and Celica's are named Mycen and Liprica and Shulk and Fiora's, idk, but they'd both be adorable blonds for sure.

I'm generally a shipping fool, honestly.

[Sentacotus]

Lets be honest though the best ship of all time is Wii Fit Trainer x Olimar.

[Magical CC]

22 hours ago, Armagon said:

I don't think having a dense protagonist in the romance is inherently a bad thing. Hell, i've met those kinds of people in real life. I think the dense protagonist trope is only bad if it's played up to ridiculous levels, which, to be fair, happens a lot. I mentioned it in my first post on this thread but Roy x Lilina is a good romance, even if Roy is dense as hell.

Of course, there is also a case to be made for comedies, since there, the dense levels are ridiculous but it's not meant to be taken seriously.

As someone who only realized I have been hit by a girl 1 year after she gave up on me....I can vote for that. Teenage boys are horny but they are also dense to obvious details.