Tempest Trials: Invisible Ties!

[Rezzy]

9 minutes ago, silveraura25 said:

Tierlists are debatable and Tailtiu (my sunshine and rainbow) being at the bottom of tier 3 blue mages is heresy

The fact that the tierlists never take Emblem (Cavalry, Flier, Armor) buffs into account makes them virtually meaningless.

[Hawk King]

31 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Well, I haven't given him all of his skills yet, including Chill Def 3 (he only has Chill Def 2 I think). And yeah, I noticed the enemies will move even if you're not in their range.

I don't have Micaiah and I dislike her a lot anyway, so using her isn't an option either. I have Deirdre, but I'm also using my Frederick and later I want to use Gerome and that's too many greens right there lol. I was going to swap out Frederick for Gerome once I got him, since Chrom is too useful for taking out Grima Robin on lunatic 5 (that Grima Robin is weaker, of course), but still.

Okay, but I still choose not to use Caeda. I sometimes will use a unit simply because the stats and weapon and all are good, but I usually pick based on favorites and make them as good as they can be. And Caeda simply isn't a favorite. I like other red fliers more.

Thankfully he has Sword Valor and can gain SP very quickly. Chill Def 3 is definitely something you want sooner than later. I only have fury 1 on mine because he doesn't need Fury 3.

I can respect someone for only using their favorites as long as they are willing to admit when a character is good.

9 minutes ago, silveraura25 said:

Tierlists are debatable and Tailtiu (my sunshine and raibow) being at the bottom of tier 3 blue mages is heresy

Every tier list I have seen is completely whacked. They are way over filled at the top and the characters at the bottom are there simply because they aren't popular and no one bothers to make good builds for them. Versatility is never taken into account. Every unit is this game can be made good in some way. Even garbage like Odin and Oboro.

[redlight]

3 minutes ago, Rezzy said:

The fact that the tierlists never take Emblem (Cavalry, Flier, Armor) buffs into account makes them virtually meaningless.

Perhaps we in Serenesforest should make our own tierlist. I remember Mangs and Mekkah making a FE 6, 7 and 8 tierlist using some kind of webpage. I better do some research on it.

Edited March 15, 2018 by silveraura25

[Tybrosion]

13 minutes ago, silveraura25 said:

Tierlists are debatable and Tailtiu (my sunshine and rainbow) being at the bottom of tier 3 blue mages is heresy

I only brought up those ratings because Arcanite brought up Gamepedia's tier list. I personally don't put any real stock into such lists either.

[redlight]

Just now, Tybrosion said:

I only brought up those ratings because Arcanite brought up Gamepedia's tier list. I personally don't put any real stock into such lists either.

Oh. Sorry about that

[Hawk King]

1 minute ago, silveraura25 said:

Perhaps we in Serenesforest should make our own tierlist. I remember Mangs and Mekkah making a FE 6, 7 and 8 tierlist using some kind of webpage. I better do some research on it.

Please no. No one will ever agree on anything and there are over 200 units with ever increasing numbers and more and more skills.

[Anacybele]

4 minutes ago, Hawk King said:

Thankfully he has Sword Valor and can gain SP very quickly. Chill Def 3 is definitely something you want sooner than later. I only have fury 1 on mine because he doesn't need Fury 3.

I can respect someone for only using their favorites as long as they are willing to admit when a character is good.

Yeah, I haven't given him Sword Valor yet either... He does have Fury 1 though.

Yeah, I can admit when a character is good. If I really know they are, anyway. Caeda sounds like she was improved, but I don't know if I can say she's really good yet.

[redlight]

8 minutes ago, Hawk King said:

Please no. No one will ever agree on anything and there are over 200 units with ever increasing numbers and more and more skills.

I mean like a post your tierlist topic. First post has every users tierlist
The webpage for making tierlists I mentioned is basically continously comparing 2 things with one another. Rankings are based on preferneces. I would make a comparison for seperate unit types, weapons and color. So basically several tierlists to make one tierlist. It was around 222 rounds for comparing 54 units for Binding Blade tierlist

Edited March 15, 2018 by silveraura25

[Ice Dragon]

1 hour ago, Arcanite said:

It's funny cause Oboro is exactly 1 tier underneath Caeda right now, using that as a reference

It's funny because you clearly didn't read the text at the top saying that comparing horizontally between two colors is meaningless.

 

34 minutes ago, Rezzy said:

The fact that the tierlists never take Emblem (Cavalry, Flier, Armor) buffs into account makes them virtually meaningless.

Gamepedia has the movement type tier ratings on the same page as the main tier list. Scroll down.

 

31 minutes ago, Hawk King said:

They are way over filled at the top

Or, you know, maybe perhaps they are like that because the characters at the top are actually comparable to each other? A tier list shouldn't be uniformly populated if weak characters are clear outliers due to poor design (or because they are welfare characters).

 

31 minutes ago, Hawk King said:

and the characters at the bottom are there simply because they aren't popular and no one bothers to make good builds for them. 

No, it's because they actually are worse than the alternatives.

 

31 minutes ago, Hawk King said:

Versatility is never taken into account.

That's because you can only run one set at time. Being able to run three different sets for three different threats is meaningless when you can only run one of those sets at any given time. Also, a unit that can run three different sets for three different threats should obviously be placed lower than a unit that can run one set that covers all three threats.

Being versatile in this game doesn't matter when you're in the middle of an Arena or Arena Assault run because you cannot change your units' builds after you have seen the opponent's team. You're stuck with one build that does what that build does, and you don't have access to the other builds that cover other threats.

 

31 minutes ago, Hawk King said:

Every unit is this game can be made good in some way.

Hence why the lowest rating in the Gamepedia tier list is 5.5/10 and not 1/10.

 

31 minutes ago, silveraura25 said:

Perhaps we in Serenesforest should make our own tierlist. I remember Mangs and Mekkah making a FE 6, 7 and 8 tierlist using some kind of webpage. I better do some research on it.

Seems pointless when Gamepedia's is better researched and better tested than any of the arguments I ever see here for tiering debates.

The authors post extensive details on how they tier units and why units are being moved up or down on Reddit for each of their big updates. I highly recommend anyone who wants to discuss tiering to at least read through their most recent update notes: Update 2.2.0 and Update 2.3.0.

[Korath88]

Honestly, I think they've improved greatly with their tiering decisions since day 1. You don't really see me complaining about them anymore. 

The thing is with units that don't have unique skills or weapons is that they are basically rated entirely on their stats. If a unit's stats are bad, any set they run will be nothing more than an inferior version of a better unit running the same kit.

I still have some gripes with the system and how they determine optimal sets (like F!Morgan having playerphase bladetome as her optimal set on gamepress) or how Est gets ranked high because of def ploy, while other ploy users don't get ranked up nearly as much. Also something about rating every bow user on how well they run brave bow iirc.

Edited March 15, 2018 by Korath88

[Ice Dragon]

17 minutes ago, Korath88 said:

(like F!Morgan having playerphase bladetome as her optimal set on gamepress)

Because her Blarblade build is her most effective build. Her 34 base Atk is only second to Valentine Lilina's 35 base Atk among non-infantry tome users, giving her powerful one-hit kill potential.

 

19 minutes ago, Korath88 said:

how Est gets ranked high because of def ploy, while other ploy users don't get ranked up nearly as much.

It's largely a combination of her flying movement type, access to a Brave weapon, and top-tier Atk stat. She has roughly the same offensive presence as Hinoka, but not only does she have superior support options, those options are also optimal for her own offensive performance.

The problem with Res Ploy is the fact that the units you want to hit with Res Ploy are the same ones with tons of Res and are therefore hard to hit with Res Ploy without sacrificing other skill slots to boost your Res stat.

 

24 minutes ago, Korath88 said:

Also something about rating every bow user on how well they run brave bow iirc.

Because the other options are not great for general use (same argument for Morgan with Blarblade). The alternative options for bows are typically situational and are better suited for Arena Assault (or Arena defense) than Arena offense.

[mampfoid]

Going to bed with a score of 25k. Tomorrow I'll welcome 5* Gerome to team 1, where he'll replace Minerva. Felicia replaced Olivia (maxed HM) on team 2 already. 

I've made one run with my Arena team accidentally. Cherches ATK with TT boost is nuts:

(That's a 4*+10 +ATK Cherche with Brave+, ATK tactics buff and TT boost. With death Blow and goad fliers that's two times 71 ATK on player phase. )

Also Felicia one-rounding a M!Robin, F!Robin one-rounding a Stahl and Donnel giving a Nephenee a quad was nice:

Spoiler

Bonus: 

(Grima was weakened up and debuffed by M!Morgan)

 

[Rafiel's Aria]

This is going to be a very productive TT. I can feel it. Priscilla maxed out HM pretty easily yesterday to be replaced by Genny who now needs less than 1k. Cecilia maxed out HM next and got replaced by Brave Lyn who just needs about 700 HM. Ursula is lacking less than 200 HM. Honestly, I forgot how easy it was to cheese the TT with Horse Emblem. I think I'm going to end up with a HUGE pile of feathers before all of this is over since I have so many characters that are really close to maxing out HM. 

Gonna use my horse team until I run out of great teammates for Chrom. After that, I think I'll switch to a mage type team with M!Morgan and Nino to give them some love. All mages probably isn't a bright idea, so my blue unit at least will be melee. 

[Javi Blizz]

I’ve been having a lot of fun doing Lunatic 5 with Gunttrhà (Blizzard, Chilling Seal, Res Ploy C, Def Ploy S), Arvis (Valflame, Def Ploy C, Threaren Spe S), Felicia (Felicia’s Plate) and F!Morgan (Atk Ploy C, Res Ploy S). I think this has been the funniest team I’ve used since launch. 

Usually Arvis kills Grima, so there’s no need to use a Falchion user (seeing Grima with Atk-6, Spe -6, Def-5 and Res-5 being the last enemy standing is sooooo cool)

[Cute Chao]

Finally got inspired to promote Marth to 5*. He deserves it :)

He'll also be useful in here, plus I'm running into more green dragons in AA.

I'm tempted to promote Chrom, too, so that I have all the falchion users (though guess I'm missing Paladin Chrom if he counts). I'll see how many feathers I get in the gauntlet before I make my decision :) 

Got my 8k for today, too. Only a few more days before 5* Gerome is home <3

[Alexmender]

Got my daily 10k a while ago so everything's going fine for now. I'm feeling a bit burnt out this time so I'll take it slowly without thinking about ranking.

I wonder what I'm going to do with the 5* Gerome though, he's not as good as his mother due to his lack of nature/merges and Poleaxe+ isn't that good considering that horses have been on a decline lately thanks to trenches while armors are going up thanks to all the busted skills they've given to them+BST stuff making the Slaying Hammer+ a more appealing weapon overall.

I think I'll leave him on my barracks in case some GHB or CC requires his specific services.

[Vaximillian]

3 hours ago, Cute Chao said:

Finally got inspired to promote Marth to 5*. He deserves it :)

I promoted my Spd/HP Marth right after the reveal of the CYL results. I should have done so earlier, he’s good. And then his updated Falchion came… He now inspires everyone around him.

[silverserpent]

Up to 15k now, I'll work on getting Gerome tomorrow. Would've had his 5*self if I hadn't had to work today.

[Arcanite]

8 hours ago, Tybrosion said:

Yeah sure, but GamePress gives Caeda a solid 4/5 rating while Oboro gets an average-at-best, mediocre-at-worst 2.5. What I should've said is that Oboro has less going for her (is a lance infantry, possibly the least impressive one of the bunch at that) when compared to Caeda, who is a rather rare unit type (sword flier) and now has a good weapon and even better refinement to go with it.

Honestly

I am so unsure as to how or why Oboro is even in this in the first place

7 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

It's funny because you clearly didn't read the text at the top saying that comparing horizontally between two colors is meaningless.

No I saw that, I was just hoping nobody else would notice hee hee

[Vaximillian]

19 minutes ago, Arcanite said:

No I saw that, I was just hoping nobody else would notice hee hee

This is the most pathetic attempt at wriggling away from admitting your wrongness I’ve ever seen, and I’ve seen many.

[Arcanite]

1 minute ago, Vaximillian said:

This is the most pathetic attempt at wriggling away from admitting your wrongness I’ve ever seen, and I’ve seen many.

This time I'm being 100% serious though LOL

[Vaximillian]

3 minutes ago, Arcanite said:

This time I'm being 100% serious though LOL

Yeah, right. You aren’t to be believed.

[Roflolxp54]

Reached 22K points so far using Olivia, Donnel, F!Robin, and Mist before the daily reset. It's not a perfect team but it does well (mostly A/A rank runs).

[Arcanite]

2 minutes ago, Vaximillian said:

Yeah, right. You aren’t to be believed.

The one time I'm actually being a treacherous mechanism

[Tybrosion]

34 minutes ago, Arcanite said:

Honestly

I am so unsure as to how or why Oboro is even in this in the first place

Because she's your "it" girl. Or rather, I guess she was until you discarded her in favor of running Nino into the ground so hard that now she's going to die before either Lugh or Raigh are born.

To talk about the TT, I've got the 5* Gerome now and have slipped back into being auto-battling trash. I'll see how far I can get tonight before Kirby Star Allies comes to devour all my free time.