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Is Mage!Kliff really that bad?


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1 minute ago, DragonFlames said:

Hence why I said it was annoying and why I find it so hard to believe it takes only 40 minutes using only the first dungeon.

You also haven't answered my question yet. I am genuinely curious.

Just skip the enemy phase and finish off what's left

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1 minute ago, DragonFlames said:

Okay then. Thanks!

Also, don't attack the enemy. Otherwise you're closer to them at the start of battle and have to waste time getting other units out of the enemy's range. Just run into them

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Mage!Kliff always did well for me in the early and mid game, but due to movement issues, fell off compared to Archers and Mercs. 

On the whole I'd say Mage!Kliff is fine. Not quite as good as he could potentially be as a Merc or Archer, but those two classes are broken in SoV, so no duh. 

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Certainly not as good as in Gaiden sadly. I'd still consider it a good option for him as a class, though Kliff has the growths to make most classes work anyway.

Movement is a concern that affects all mages and while other units do get more magic now, he still has a more versatile offensive list than most of those you'd compare him to.

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On 4/1/2018 at 4:49 PM, DisobeyedCargo said:

I've seen a lot of people agree that Mage is one of Kliff's worst classes. I just don't see it. He does start off with low speed, but that's easily fixed with the speed fountain and his high speed growth. He also has a great spell list. So why is it one of his worst classes? He always does well in that class for me.

For me, the answer is going to be representative more of the type of player. If you like to rush the game, play everything as it comes and make it as difficult as you possibly can, then he's going to lag behind. If you like to grind, built units up slow, and level up even the weaker units to see what they could be, then he's going to be a beast. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Mage Kliff is complete garbage. 1 AS should be more than enough to know he is worthless.

Edited by L9999
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Kliff only has 1 AS at base as a mage when using his fire tome. This means that without grinding he will not be doubling anything at all for a while, limiting his contribution. There's also the fact that mages are often considered shit in SoV due to their awful mov and single late promo, but that's besides the point.

If you want an early game mage, just use Mage Tobin. He can actually double things at base and gets Excalibur incredibly quickly.

 

Edited by CatManThree
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On 4/7/2018 at 1:46 AM, Emperor Hardin said:

The only real bad class is anyone as a Soldier.

The Cavalier class got nerfed and Mages overall are often considered bad for multiple reasons.

Edited by CatManThree
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3 hours ago, CatManThree said:

The Cavalier class got nerfed and Mages overall are often considered bad for multiple reasons.

Cav ain't that bad. My Cav!Kliff was great from the outset and later on down the line became a 2nd Mathilda with actual bulk. Though I will agree, it is still the third best option after Merc and Archer.

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9 hours ago, L9999 said:

Mage Kliff is complete garbage. 1 AS should be more than enough to know he is worthless.

What about the water of speed in the beginning though, can't that easily patch him up?

Edited by DisobeyedCargo
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For me he relied to heavily on needing to critical to do anything and he barely landed critical hit (a problem I have with a lot of the units in Echoes). I benched his ass for Delthea (my MVP) I'm not going to lie.

Edited by I'm a Spheal
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22 hours ago, DisobeyedCargo said:

What about the water of speed in the beginning though, can't that easily patch him up?

The two speed increases only brings him up to 3 AS. So he is still not gonna double anything unless you grind him level ups.

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23 hours ago, Azz said:

Cav ain't that bad. My Cav!Kliff was great from the outset and later on down the line became a 2nd Mathilda with actual bulk. Though I will agree, it is still the third best option after Merc and Archer.

I was not referring to Cav!Kliff, I was referring to the class as a whole. The Cavalier isn't as good as there aren't very many units who can actually function well in the class due to it not receiving growth modifiers, and their no longer as impressive bases. The only units not counting pitch fork reclassing that can function all that well without special treatment to my knowledge are every unit who joins as a member of the Cav line other than Clive, Faye, and Kliff.

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On 25/4/2018 at 10:49 AM, DisobeyedCargo said:

What about the water of speed in the beginning though, can't that easily patch him up?

Those belong to Silque.

http://aminoapps.com/p/zejaor

Math on why Kliff with spd boosts blows.

 

Edited by L9999
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Just now, Carmine Sword said:

The speed boosts let her double brigands and archers in the next few chapters after her recruitment, making it easier for he to get exp and reach Warp sooner.

I uh, never let silque fight, like ever

ive always given them to Kliff so he can build up his speed 

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I'll say it once and I'll say it again. Kliff is the most flexible unit out there. Any thing you promote him into and he'll do fine and Mage!Kliff is no exception. Really, you almost can't screw him up and while he may not be able to use Seraphram, he's still passable as a Mage and mages in this game are really good.

There's nothing wrong in what class you put him on overall.

 

Edited by Harvey
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On 4/25/2018 at 6:05 AM, CatManThree said:

There's also the fact that mages are often considered shit in SoV due to their awful mov and single late promo, but that's besides the point.

Maybe by people who have terrible opinions.

Mages having actual weapon flexibility (without needing to trade), targeting res in a game where the gap is higher than normal, and ignoring terrain in the game where terrain is the most impactful in the series, all help make them very useful indeed.

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Mage Kliff is not bad. He's pound-for-pound the same as FE2 Kliff. The difference is, every other unit in Echoes is mostly better than their FE2 counterpart, meaning that Kliff is no longer far and a way the best at being a mage (because of Tobin's early Excalibur). He's still a good mage though - he's good in any class not called Soldier, really, it's just that now he doesn't outclass all the other mages like he did before (well, he arguably doesn't outclass FE2!Luthier).

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 2/5/2018 at 7:55 AM, YouSquiddinMe said:

Mage Kliff is not bad. He's pound-for-pound the same as FE2 Kliff. The difference is, every other unit in Echoes is mostly better than their FE2 counterpart, meaning that Kliff is no longer far and a way the best at being a mage (because of Tobin's early Excalibur). He's still a good mage though - he's good in any class not called Soldier, really, it's just that now he doesn't outclass all the other mages like he did before (well, he arguably doesn't outclass FE2!Luthier).

Mage Kiff sucks ass in Gaiden. The only reason he is made a mage is because Kliff is the most disposable of the villagers.

 

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I've always made Kliff a mage, always. He isn't bad for me, ever. I've never Kliff bad as a mage either, his spell list is fine, his stats are fine, he was good in Gaiden for me.

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