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General Character Usefulness Discussion


Smfthegeek
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20 minutes ago, Tables said:

Navarre's (/Lyn's) moveset is pretty solid as well. It's main weakness is actually the same as Xander's main weakness I feel, which is a fairly slow C4. Except, Xander's C4 has huge range, while Navarre's doesn't. Still, Navarre's C6 is pretty crazy and breaks gauges easily, while AoE damaging heavily. Xander has mobility going for him, as well as slightly better stats.

Yeah its kinda funny honestly as much of a nerd of Warriors games as I am, I never really sit down and properly think "Ok who's the best" Like I can generally tell what movesets are amazing I just never piece everythin entirely together.

I think you have it down though.

Edited by Jedi
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1 hour ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

How does Tharja stack up relative to Robin and Linde? Stat-wise.

Her lower skill & luck will likely leave her on the lower end, but her unique attack and seemingly faster attack speed might be good for some alternative builds.

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4 hours ago, Jedi said:

Her lower skill & luck will likely leave her on the lower end, but her unique attack and seemingly faster attack speed might be good for some alternative builds.

Was it ever confirmed that clones have different attack speeds?

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3 hours ago, Arthur97 said:

Was it ever confirmed that clones have different attack speeds?

I'm pretty sure all moveset clones have the same attack speed unless for some reason you are trying to compare one clone using astra and they other without it. I could be wrong about Tharja and Robin though since the devs made her slightly different compared to the other clones and I haven't used either that much to notice any difference.

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6 hours ago, Jedi said:

Her lower skill & luck will likely leave her on the lower end, but her unique attack and seemingly faster attack speed might be good for some alternative builds.

 

52 minutes ago, NSSKG151 said:

I'm pretty sure all moveset clones have the same attack speed unless for some reason you are trying to compare one clone using astra and they other without it. I could be wrong about Tharja and Robin though since the devs made her slightly different compared to the other clones and I haven't used either that much to notice any difference.

Well, from my own testings, if there is a difference in attack speed, it's practically nonexistent, so I think they both have the same attack speed.

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2 hours ago, NSSKG151 said:

I'm pretty sure all moveset clones have the same attack speed unless for some reason you are trying to compare one clone using astra and they other without it. I could be wrong about Tharja and Robin though since the devs made her slightly different compared to the other clones and I haven't used either that much to notice any difference.

It might just be an illusion or I'm thinking Robin was slower for some reason.

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Tharja's C6 seems to me to be very similar to Robin's C6. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if they had totally identical hitboxes, and just a different visual effect to make the move fit Tharja better. I don't think either is faster than the other.

So with that in mind... honestly, they're pretty close. Tharja has much better defence, but Robin has a little bit more Luck. Robin hits harder, but Tharja has longer Awakening and is more durable.

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4 hours ago, Tables said:

Tharja's C6 seems to me to be very similar to Robin's C6. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if they had totally identical hitboxes, and just a different visual effect to make the move fit Tharja better. I don't think either is faster than the other.

So with that in mind... honestly, they're pretty close. Tharja has much better defence, but Robin has a little bit more Luck. Robin hits harder, but Tharja has longer Awakening and is more durable.

Honestly even though I love Tharja, I have issues with her luck and skill. Seeing as those two stats practically rule the game (if you need an example see Olivia because her strength is bad but shes insanely usefull because of her skill and luck growths.) Im having a hard time figuring out how to fully utilize Tharja. I mean things like luna arent even worth the materials on her because of her luck :(

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Skill is one of the less important stats, at least if we're talking more optimised characters with 720 power weapons. That skill stat does not have much influence on damage, and it mostly only affects crits anyway.

 

Luck is by far the most important, after that it's sorta just... depends a bit on how good you are at avoiding enemies. If you're good, then it's probably Speed, then Str/Mag, then Skl, then the three defensive stats. If you're less good, it's probably Res, then Def, then HP, then Spd, then Str/Mag and finally Skl.

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2 minutes ago, Tables said:

Skill is one of the less important stats, at least if we're talking more optimised characters with 720 power weapons. That skill stat does not have much influence on damage, and it mostly only affects crits anyway.

 

Luck is by far the most important, after that it's sorta just... depends a bit on how good you are at avoiding enemies. If you're good, then it's probably Speed, then Str/Mag, then Skl, then the three defensive stats. If you're less good, it's probably Res, then Def, then HP, then Spd, then Str/Mag and finally Skl.

What skills should I give Olivia? Decking out her sword should be an easy task but skills can be a bit touch and go with certain characters.  (Also her and Azura decimate evryone when paired up because of their both having the refresh ability )

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For her weapon I've got Mountslayer, Wingslayer, Genpeer, Stonebreaker, Amped and Pair Up+, but really, you can put a lot of good things in place of Genpeer and Stonebreaker.

 

For personal skills: Astra, Luna, Lethality and Luck+20 are definite for her. The remaining two... good options are:

Resonating Power (her Mag and Strength are pretty close, so you get about +20% damage from this at level 150 and more at lower levels)

Galeforce (more specials and Awakening)

Vengeance (all around damage boost - she'll have a 100% lethality rate from about level 120, so Vengeance boots her non-crit damage significantly, up to +300% at 1 HP IIRC)

Awakening (if you want to use Galeforce and capitalise on spending large amounts of time in Awakening, +25% damage for it)

Solidarity (if you pair up a lot, a free +25% to partner shouldn't be underestimated)

Lone Wolf (if you don't pair up, +50% damage is basically the single best skill you can use outside of Luna)

Pavise/Aegis (with her high luck, these provide a huge damage reduction. If you care about boosting defences, these will make a huge difference to your durability)

 

Personally I'd most likely run Solidarity and Vengeance for the all around damage boosting, but a lot of good options here exist.

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30 minutes ago, Tables said:

For her weapon I've got Mountslayer, Wingslayer, Genpeer, Stonebreaker, Amped and Pair Up+, but really, you can put a lot of good things in place of Genpeer and Stonebreaker.

 

For personal skills: Astra, Luna, Lethality and Luck+20 are definite for her. The remaining two... good options are:

Resonating Power (her Mag and Strength are pretty close, so you get about +20% damage from this at level 150 and more at lower levels)

Galeforce (more specials and Awakening)

Vengeance (all around damage boost - she'll have a 100% lethality rate from about level 120, so Vengeance boots her non-crit damage significantly, up to +300% at 1 HP IIRC)

Awakening (if you want to use Galeforce and capitalise on spending large amounts of time in Awakening, +25% damage for it)

Solidarity (if you pair up a lot, a free +25% to partner shouldn't be underestimated)

Lone Wolf (if you don't pair up, +50% damage is basically the single best skill you can use outside of Luna)

Pavise/Aegis (with her high luck, these provide a huge damage reduction. If you care about boosting defences, these will make a huge difference to your durability)

 

Personally I'd most likely run Solidarity and Vengeance for the all around damage boosting, but a lot of good options here exist.

So when it comes to slayer weapon attributes. When it says it reduces damage against other enemies how much of a reduction is there?

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2 hours ago, smfthegeek said:

So when it comes to slayer weapon attributes. When it says it reduces damage against other enemies how much of a reduction is there?

Slayer attributes reduces a weapon's power by 20%. However, personal weapons with True Power/Divine Favor or regular weapons with the Legendary weapon attribute removes this penalty.

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On 4/7/2018 at 7:49 PM, Jedi said:

Her lower skill & luck will likely leave her on the lower end, but her unique attack and seemingly faster attack speed might be good for some alternative builds.

I remember when people said the same thing for Lucina in comparison to Chrom. I think it's safe to say Robin and Tharja have the same attack speeds.

 

15 hours ago, Tables said:

So with that in mind... honestly, they're pretty close. Tharja has much better defence, but Robin has a little bit more Luck. Robin hits harder, but Tharja has longer Awakening and is more durable.

Put Statflip on Robin (which people should be doing anyway for higher Mag and Def), and that durability increase doesn't matter for Tharja. Of course, that means one less attribute slot for Robin to use.

Edited by MrPerson0
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I think the thing throwing people off about Tharja is the same thing that threw me off about Niles. Their running animations visually look faster. Niles has a more distinct sprint, with a compliated costume that looks like he's really booking. Tharja's float looks like it would move her faster, probably from her pose and lack of giant trenchcoat.

 

Bit surprised there was no "move+1" skill, actually. Maybe next game

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5 hours ago, smfthegeek said:

How do Lyn and Navarre compare against each other?

Statistically, Navarre wins the important stats, but the gaps are small enough to be negligible pretty much all the time. Lyn has Dracoslayer innate on Sol Katti while Wo Dao has nothing, which means she has an extra slot, but that also means she's stuck with Dracoslayer as one of her two slayer skills, which is arguably not a great slayer skill for swords.

They're pretty much equal in my eyes.

Edited by Florete
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7 hours ago, MrPerson0 said:

Put Statflip on Robin (which people should be doing anyway for higher Mag and Def), and that durability increase doesn't matter for Tharja. Of course, that means one less attribute slot for Robin to use.

Statflip is definitely an option for Robin, but as you note it does mean one less valuable weapon slot. So I don't think it's as automatic as that. I personally do have him running Statflip, along with Armour Strike for the unbreakable defence combo, although really Armour Strike isn't great in general.

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Personally, I'm partial to Robin because his Critical Hits are much more powerful (due to slightly higher Mag and Luck stats and significantly higher Skill).

As for Navarre vs. Lyn, Navarre not being stuck with Dracoslayer (allowing for Plate + Wingslayer) + slightly better stats makes him slightly better than Lyn despite Lyn's extra slot. (Especially as it makes Wo Dao rather flexible in what it can do.)

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On 4/8/2018 at 4:35 AM, Tables said:

Tharja's C6 seems to me to be very similar to Robin's C6. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if they had totally identical hitboxes, and just a different visual effect to make the move fit Tharja better. I don't think either is faster than the other.

So with that in mind... honestly, they're pretty close. Tharja has much better defence, but Robin has a little bit more Luck. Robin hits harder, but Tharja has longer Awakening and is more durable.

Since you research the game so much, I would pose this question to you:

How much of an effect do the War God Crests have on the amount of time the stun gauge is visible?

Also, I wanna know whose materials the SD and Awakening DLC characters need.

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8 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Since you research the game so much, I would pose this question to you:

How much of an effect do the War God Crests have on the amount of time the stun gauge is visible?

Also, I wanna know whose materials the SD and Awakening DLC characters need.

Navarre wants Marth and Caeda materials. (He also wants Outlaw Materials.)

Minerva wants Linde, Marth, and Navarre materials.

Linde wants Minerva and Gharnef materials.

Owain wants Niles, Lissa, and Lucina materials.

Tharja wants Olivia, Robin, and Validar materials.

Olivia wants Robin, Tharja, and Chrom materials.

And they all want their own materials for the usual crests that require one's own material. (Combo Crest IV, Skill Crest III-V, Mastery Crest, Sanctuary Crest, and Talent Crest III.)

Edited by Folt
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9 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Since you research the game so much, I would pose this question to you:

How much of an effect do the War God Crests have on the amount of time the stun gauge is visible?

Also, I wanna know whose materials the SD and Awakening DLC characters need.

 

Never checked it explicitly, but I would wager a guess it's 10%, 20%, 50% for each tier respectively. Most crests seem to scale a bit like that.

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So my question about Olivia is do i need to rely on her luck for things like lethality to take out big enemies? She just seems to lack the brute strength of others. Shes like lv 106 she has luna pavis luck+20 galeforce lethality and astra. what should i do to maximize her usefulness? Like it takes forever to take out lv 120 enemies with her but super quick with Lyn whos like lv 110 which isnt a big difference

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