Zapp Branniglenn Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Lucina - The best offensive spread among Falchion wielders, though a lot of swords have come out since launch beating her 34/36 stats. Plus nobody beats Alm at dragon killing or just deleting threats. Just like with Chrom I think the falchion refinement is superior to Sealed Falchion, especially in Arena Offense where you could kite and wait for her health to refill. Lucina can't measure up to Marth's utility, but I'm willing to rate her as high just through good stats.7 out of 10. M!Corrin - Surprised more people aren't into this guy. Tripled support bonuses can boost an ally, especially one with a balanced stat spread, like dragons and armors. Corrin himself gains some stats natively too. I wish he wasn't competing for the red slot on a team, which is the most competitive. If you're not killing dragons and don't have incredible stats, what good are you? 6 out of 10. I feel like his main comptition is Marth. Marth's drive everything boost is only half as good but indiscriminate, plus he can play medic and kill dragons in a pinch. Lot of Marth comparisons today. I sure do like Mister Tiara Past Ratings Spoiler Alfonse - 3 Marth - 7 Sharena - 3 Jagen - 1 Anna - 4.5 Barst - 3 Cain - 4 Draug - 7.5 Gordin - 5 Jeorge - 5.5 Abel - 5.5 Linde - 9 Minerva - Abstain Merric - 3.5 Maria - 6 Wrys - 3.5 Ceada - Abstain Ogma - 4 Catria - 4 Est - 6 Sheena - 6.5 Cecilia - 4 Clarine - 6.5 Matthew - 4 Palla - 2.5 Roy -7 Gwendolyn - 7.5 Shanna - 4.5 Bartre - 7 Fae - 7.5 Serra - 4 Lissa - 2 Y!Tiki - 8 Lilina - 7 Florina - 1.5 M!Robin - 3.5 Hector - 8 Raven - 8.5 Gaius - 4 out of 10 Virion - 3.5 Raigh - 1.5 Sophia - 3.5 Sully -2.5 Cordelia -7 Hawkeye - 5.5 Nino - 8 Felicia - 6.5 Jakob - 1 Fir - 4 Eliwood - 5.5 Donnel - 3.5 Nowi - 8.5 Frederick - 6.5 Cherche - 7.5 Saizo - 4 Kagero - 4.5 Lyn - 7 Chrom - 5 F!Corrin - 7 Azura - 6.5 Gunter - 3 Camilla - 5.5 Azama - 6.5 Setsuna - 3.5 Stahl - 2.5 Lonqu - 3 Hinoka - 7.5 Oboro - 2.5 Beruka - 6 Arthur - 2 Takumi - 5.5 Sakura - 3 Olivia - 7 Henry - 2 Subaki - 4.5 Peri - 6.5 Niles - 1.5 Elise - 7.5 Tharja - 5 A!Tiki - 8 Odin - 1 Effie - 7.5 Lucina - 7 M!Corrin - 6 Ratings I would change in retrospect: Gordin would be a 2.5, Cain would be a 3.5, Linde would be 7. Nowi would be an 8. And I'd drop Matthew and Saizo to 3.5. Beruka would be a 7. Caeda I'd rate a 6 now that I've been using her at 5 star. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexmender Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Well, I do consider Y!Tiki superior to her Adult version at maximum potential (at +10 with perfect skillset) but that's just me though. Lucina. She has a offensive spread with 34 Atk and 36 Spd putting her with the likes of Hana in terms of sheer stats. What sets Lucina apart is her Prf weapon, Falchion. This allows her to be a pretty competent anti-dragon unit and the in-built Renewal 2 effect will keep her healthy for most of the battle. While she was starting to feel the pressure from the new big monsters like Ayra the weapon refinery gave her 2 new niches to work with. With the Falchion Bond refine Lucina gains +4 to every stat as long as she's adjacent to an ally, making her a pretty strong unit in the Enemy Phase which is pretty useful as many dragons have a weak player phase which further cements Lucina as a Dragon slayer. Her second choice is to disregard the EP completely and become a Player Phase monster with Sealed Falchion, as this weapon grants her +5 in every stat as long as her Hp is below 100%. This effect is active during combat which means it can be paired with field buffs like Hone/Fortify/Tactics, and also creates a pretty dangerous mind game with her. She can run Fury to get a strong +8 to every stat or go full offense with Brazen Atk/Spd to become one of the most threatening units in this game. Long story short, Lucina is a beast and if you use her correctly she'll be capable of almost soloing entire maps on her own. Rating: 8.5/10 M!Corrin. He has a balanced spread which lets him be either more tanky or more offensive. This brings the problem of "Jack of all trades" which many release units have, they can do a lot of jobs but they are worse than more specialized units. Corrin's Prf weapon, Yato is also pretty unimpressive when it comes to combat potential. Thanks to the weapon refinery he is able to become one of the best support units in the game, although this comes at the cost of only working for the player as his effect requires the use of the Ally Support system to work. He can always go for a +Stat refine in order to work on his own as the +2 on every stat that Yato gives on PP makes him a pretty competent unit, even if not all that unique. If you use him to his strengths he'll prove a very valuable unit but he tends to lack flexibility due to how his weapon works. Rating: 6.5/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenomata Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 1 hour ago, The Priest said: Man, someone of these scores are really out of place. Odin is pretty bad but he is certainly not as bad as Jagen, Gunter, Arthur or Lissa. Jagen and Gunter has good Resistance and Defense, respectively, and can pull off builds centered around such, albeit not as good as others could. Arthur can at least fulfill being a lance killer, and Lissa... nah, she's pretty bad even when strictly recovering ally HP. ANYWAYS. Lucina Spoiler With 34/36 base offenses, Lucina is one of the original sword units who fared better than many of the others we got. While her defensive ability is below average, and Falchions Renewal effect doesn't really do her many favors in that regard, she usually doesn't care and just wants to focus on her offensive game. Falchion itself doesn't offer many raw power advantages besides higher base might and dragon effectiveness, but a refine is all it takes to fix that. Sealed Falchion is the one I'll be using for my rating, as it enables Lucina to be an offensive threat without having to stick close to allies. Lucina's biggest problem, in my opinion, is that she's an Infantry Sword who lacks the same speed or attack that many newer, and sometimes more available, sword infantries have, and her personal weapon doesn't do her many favors before refinement. Her defense is also a problem, as she is the least bulky of all the Falchion users. Small nitpicks though, as she has the potential to become a deadly force with Sealed Falchion. Her speed, which is already pretty good, gets better just when she takes any damage, and her attack goes from average to great at the same time. Any passive A skill that boosts her speed will make her one of the faster swords in the game, and if she runs with Desperation, she only further enables her ORKO potential. While other Sword Infantry units can do what she can do, Lucina has the tools necessary to match them. She is a good pull if you manage to get her. Rating: 7.5/10 Lucina has fared well from the start, and her biggest issue is mostly that she has to compete with other Sword Infantry. Once given the tools, however, she is able to match said units, if not outpace them overall. She is, however less bulky than much of her competition. Corrin (Male) Spoiler Corrin's offensive ability hasn't really changed too much since his inception, even after getting an update to his personal weapon, Yato. He's far more balanced than many of the other Sword Infantry in the game, but not so balanced that it hurts his ability to match them. Yato pre-refine at least had the benefit of built-in Darting Blow 2, so his speed wasn't as low as it looked at first. Post refine, his balanced statline is boosted slightly, but the biggest thing he can get from the new Yato is Supportive, his personal skill from Fates, increasing his support partners stats by 4 when they are nearby in addition to the stat boost they get just from being near Corrin. Combine this with Spurs and Drives, and Corrin enables units to be even more offensive or defensive than before. Thankfully, Corrin can still handle himself in combat, and doesn't have to take the purely supportive refine. He can take a Defense refine to become a bulky Sword unit, a Speed refine to become a Fast sword unit, a Resistance refine to be a very mixed defensive sword unit, or even an Attack refine to become a pretty Strong sword unit. That's the power in being balanced and also having a Spectrum Up stat boost. Overall, Corrin is balanced, but in a good way, unlike many of the other units who are balanced. He isn't the best Sword unit, but he can still pull off whatever it is you want him to do thanks to the refined Yato. It's worth it to see just what kind of Corrin you yourself have, and then building from there. Rating: 6.5/10 Corrin is fairly balanced, but his Yato, depending on how it is refined, enables him to do whatever it is you'd like him to do. He's a Jack of All Trades, Master of None, but still able to match most Masters of One. I'd rate him higher if he had a specific niche to fulfill, and he does at least provide powerful Combat Buffs to the ally he supports, but I honestly believe it'd be best to try him out yourself and find out just what you want him to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordFrigid Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 (edited) Lucina Offense-focused stat line featuring good Atk and Spd, mediocre Def, and low Res. Access to Falchion (effective against dragons, built-in Renewal 2) grants her a dragon-checking niche and sustain. The effect refinement (Atk/Spd/Def/Res+4 when adjacent to an ally, upgrades the Renewal effect to lv. 3) is a decent stat-boosting tool, but is difficult to leverage on offense. Access to Sealed Falchion (effective against dragons, Atk/Spd/Def/Res+5 when below 100% HP) is a powerful offensive tool after Lucina takes damage. On offense, it will only be worse than regular Falchion on her first round of combat, if she somehow manages to attack from a space adjacent to an ally (which is generally difficult to set up). It is then strictly better on each subsequent engagement (as far as combat performance). Very strong green, strong red matchups on offense with a Sealed Falchion/Desperation set. Struggles with bulky reds and the bulkiest of greens unless she can get a special off. Thanks to dragon effectiveness, she at won't get walled by Myrrh or Tiki. Very strong green, decent red matchups on defense with a Falchion (Eff)/Distant Counter set. Strongly benefits from extra stat stacking. Has trouble with Bold Fighter sets and fast, one-round-special foes unless Guard is run, and has trouble sustaining herself unless Renewal is run. It's worth noting that her offensive stat line is capable of engaging some Bold Fighter-carrying foes on the Player Phase. She can also opt to focus on one-range matchups by using a Bond, Stance, or Breath skill over Distant Counter. She has some Panic Ploy capability against mages and lower-HP melees with her HP stat, but otherwise cannot provide much team support beyond the standard field/combat buff. Built-in Renewal can give her some heal support options. Overall, I give her 8.5 for combat (very strong green, strong red matchups on offense, useful combat niche), and 1 for support (basic field/combat buff, some Panic Ploy capability), for a total rating of 8/10. I've always been interested to see how the effect-refined Falchion did as part of an actual set, but never actually got around to running the numbers until now. It was interesting to see, but unfortunate that her lower defenses make it difficult to take full advantage of the weapon's enemy phase capabilities. I did not factor heal support into her support score, because her Sealed Falchion set was used for her combat score. Corrin Somewhat balanced stat line featuring decent Atk and Spd, and mediocre Def and Res. Yato (built-in Darting Blow 2) is a decent offensive weapon, while its refinement (Atk/Spd/Def/Res+2) bumps his balanced stat line to a...slightly higher balanced stat line. He can take a Spd refinement to improve his own combat performance (Atk/Def/Res+2, Spd+5), or the effect refinement (Atk/Spd/Def/Res+4 to ally supported unit within 2 spaces) to become a powerful stat-support unit. Very strong green, decent red matchups on offense with a basic Swift Sparrow/Life and Death set (using effect-refined Yato). Has trouble with exceptionally fast or exceptionally bulky foes. He also does not have the Def to break through Myrrh's Great Flame (especially with Life and Death). Good green, poor red matchups on defense with a Distant Counter set. His stat line isn't very well optimized for it. He does reasonably well for himself with a Steady Breath kit against one-range foes, but cannot counter ranged foes with it. Yato is a premier support weapon, providing a massive Atk/Spd/Def/Res+4 combat buff to Corrin's supported ally (Atk/Spd/Def/Res+6 when adjacent). He has some Panic Ploy capability over mages, though he is most likely running spurs or drives instead, to complement his weapon. Overall, I give him 7 for combat (very strong green, decent red matchups on offense), and 2.5 for support (Yato, Panic Ploy capability, basic field/combat buff), for a total rating of 7/10. I was mildly surprised to see his combat capabilities as good as they were. I guess Yato effectively bumping his offenses to 34/34 helped him out a lot. Pity he still can't reliably handle Myrrh, though (I also tried with Fury in his A slot, to no avail). I did end up needing to bump him down a bit due to his difficulty with prominent meta threats (Myrrh, Zelgius, Ayra, to name a few). The effect refinement bonus gave him a pretty nice bump, and he ended up with a decent rating. ~ Scoring method: Spoiler Units are evaluated based on both their combat performance and their team support capabilities (i.e. their whole contribution to a team). Combat performance is judged by matchups, especially against enemies that are at triangle disadvantage or neutral to the unit. Performance against more relevant meta threats is more valuable than performance against units that are rarely seen. Triangle Adept sets are not considered, though they might be noted. Scale of 0 to 10. Sustainability and filling a useful niche are given small bonuses, when applicable. I will look at least one PP-focused and one EP-focused skill set for each unit, but only evaluate based on performance for whichever phase I deem the unit to be stronger on. Support capabilities are decided by how much support a unit can provide (without horribly compromising their combat capabilities), and how valuable I feel that support is. Scale of 0 to 3. At the end, the combat and support scores will be weighted (with a heavy focus on combat performance), combined, and rounded to the nearest .5 to obtain the total rating. Dancers and Singers will get +1 point to their total rating (not to exceed 10), because I value Dance/Sing utility highly. This method of evaluation essentially compares each unit to a hypothetical "god unit" who is stellar at everything, instead of each unit to each other. All my ratings. ~ Just for fun, I dropped a few query functions in my ratings sheet, and here's a breakdown by color of all units rated thus far (final averages): Spoiler Edited June 12, 2018 by LordFrigid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafiel's Aria Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 7 hours ago, The Priest said: Well, of course. We're not going to redo everything in the middle of the first round. Also I'm not necessarily up to do the re-run as well. Someone else should do that one if the demand is there. Odin: 1.89 Effie: 8.72 Man, someone of these scores are really out of place. Odin is pretty bad but he is certainly not as bad as Jagen, Gunter, Arthur or Lissa. Him, Merric, Niles and Gaius could use some slightly higher scores than what they got now. Also Young Tiki managed to score better than her Adult form. ... nope. I figured as much. It'd definitely be a lot of trouble for you, and I wouldn't want that. I only really asked since refines can significantly alter a character's performance which may end up making the rankings obsolete long before the first round even finishes. For this round, I'll abstain from M. Corrin. I haven't done any research about him and have no plans to use him whatsoever. I have seen some creative builds for him though. Lucina on the other hand I've used quite a bit. Lucina - She was top of her class when the game first started. Unfortunately, she has a little bit of trouble competing with the newest swordswomen based on her stats alone. 34/36 offensive stats still aren't anything to laugh at, especially when combined with her weapon's refinement that gives her a "spectrum bond" effect, easily bumping her up to 38/40 just by being next to an ally. Her bulk isn't anything amazing, but she can run a medic build, effectively turning herself into a healer or a hyper-offensive dragon slayer. She hits hard and fast like most meta-defining sword units, but her dragon slaying abilities help give her a niche, especially when dragons like Myrrh and Grima are popular choices in the Arena. She can function outside of her niche as well, providing support, healing, or offense as desired. Unfortunately, she does come with a lackluster base kit outside of Falchion and Aether, so she'll require more effort to build than other characters introduced later in the game. I'll give her an 8.5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Emblem Fan Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 Lucina: The second-best Falchion user! She has the synergy of Marth, but a little more speed and a bit less bulk than Chrom. Even so, she's a deadly unit that can really wreck you with some good skills. Most of what I'd have to say I've already said when I talked about Marth, she's basically like that but faster and a little better. Still only the second-best Falchion user, though. 8/10 Corrin: Eh, Corrin is okay. His weapon refinement seems...good? But also kind of odd? Without refinement, his weapon isn't as good as one would think it should be. With skill inheritance, he can ascend to better plains, but he's still not quite at the level of a bunch of other sword users. He lacks the speed of someone like Lucina or Lyn, the all-round greatness of Alm, synergy of Marth, etc. He's okay, but not great. 5/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Dragon Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 8 hours ago, The Priest said: Man, someone of these scores are really out of place. Odin is pretty bad but he is certainly not as bad as Jagen, Gunter, Arthur or Lissa. Him, Merric, Niles and Gaius could use some slightly higher scores than what they got now. Also Young Tiki managed to score better than her Adult form. ... nope. No, Odin really is that bad. Odin not only doesn't have access to a Slaying weapon to help offset his abysmally low Atk, but the only weapon that can add enough Atk to make his normal attacks deal reasonable damage at all slows down his Special activation and has no access to refines. In contrast, Jagen, Gunter, and Arthur can all run Slaying builds, and Jagen and Gunter also have access to movement type buffs. Mystery Tiki has passable Spd and mixed bulk, and her lower Atk isn't really an issue due to the refined breath effect and access to Steady/Warding Breath. Awakening Tiki has a slight edge at the very top of the Arena Assault (750+) where every armor will double you regardless, giving her slightly better physical bulk some extra value, but Mystery Tiki actually has a player phase with a Spd refine, which is more valuable elsewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiki Posted June 12, 2018 Author Share Posted June 12, 2018 (edited) Lucina: 7.79 Corrin: 6.17 @Ice Dragon @Xenomata Yes, his Atk sucks but he is in the right color and class to circumvent it. I'm nothing saying that he is not terrible but being a mage kinda saves him from being rock bottom (though he is the worst mage by far). Odin with full buffs, L&D and Spd seal has 159:55:29 against +10 merges with Fury which is not terrible. 60/63 bulk without buffs (depending on which bane you choose) coupled with 43 Spd to tank a hit is not garbage either since it is ideal for Desperation. In comparison no matter how much I favor Jagen and Gunter with Cavalry buffs etc. they are not that great with their Slaying builds. Maybe Jagen because he has that outrageous Res but I don't see how Arthur and Gunter with their abyssmal stats are supposed to be better than a mage (albeit the worst one of the bunch). Yorokobe, we have now officially entered Red hell. Ryoma, Peerless Samurai Spoiler Max. Stats: 37/41/44 31/34/37 32/35/38 23/27/30 18/21/24 Base Skills: Raijinto ( Unit can counterattack regardless of foe's range. ) ( - ) Astra Defiant Atk ( - ) Hone Spd Hinata, Wild Samurai Spoiler Max. Stats: 44/47/50 29/32/35 21/24/28 33/36/39 15/18/21 Base Skills: Ruby Sword+ ( - ) Pavise Fury Brash Assault ( - ) Edited June 13, 2018 by The Priest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenomata Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, The Priest said: Yes, his Atk sucks but he is in the right color and class to circumvent it. I'm nothing saying that he is not terrible but being a mage kinda saves him from being rock bottom (though he is the worst mage by far). I mentioned it myself, but it's not like Blarblade is bad. Odin is a cheap user of it, if you have skill fodder but no other users for Blarblade. Anyways... Ryoma Spoiler The original hell unit, alongside his little bro. Having Distant Counter on his sword was reason enough to consider him a tough target, but his statline was downright mean when the options for Distant Counter users were more limited. Give him Vantage and a Special, and Ryoma's below-average defensive ability makes it all the harder to get the kill if you didn't get it on the first round of combat. And because of his Speed and not many options back then, Ryoma was a unit you would have had to build a unit specifically to counter. Nowadays... well, Ryoma's not BAD, per say, but... he's outclasses. Distant Counter weapons generally only need Speed to avoid doubles, which Ryoma can do, but they also generally want more bulk and power, which Ryoma is less gifted in. Ryoma is also an Infantry Sword, which means loads of competition for things he could be doing. A simple Fury/Vantage/Moonbow build is generally enough for Ryoma to get through the day. Ryoma does Distant Counter pretty good, but he has certainly seen better days. Rating: 7.5/10 Ryoma used to be the premier Distant Counter Sword. Now that he's largely been outclassed by others, including a Legendary variant of himself, he at least still has the statline to pull off something else, and can still pull off an effective DC set. Just know that there are other options, and that Ryoma himself is one of them. Hinata Spoiler I won't say Hinata is bad. Generally speaking, bulk and power can be appreciated if used the right way, and Hinata is not shy on either front. Like Subaki and Arthur, Hinata is able to soundly counter Axe units without taking much damage in return, though his base kit is not quite as built for such a role, as Fury 3 is okay, but Brash Assault requires him to hit an HP threshold that will take Hinata a bit longer than other units (47 base HP at 5* max level no merge). Pavise is also largely redundant since Hinata won't be taking much physical damage in the first place. Hinata has two glaring problems. Where Arthur and Subaki has passable and great Speed, Hinata has base 24 with a possible Superboon. If he wants to get any significant damage dealt, he needs Quick Riposte, a Weaponbreaker, or Brash Assault to get a double triggered (though I'd recommend going with Brash Assault as a SS rather than using his default B skill). His other problem has a strong gaze: His Resistance sucks. He can take one Magic hit, but mages are commonly faster than Hinata by miles, and even neutral Spd dragons can outpace Hinata. Hinata has power AND physical defense. One is great for an Infantry unit, the other lets him deal some damage without having to rely on specials, even if he has one of the stronger Bonfires/Ignis's in the game. His Panic Ploy and Infantry Pulse game is also really good. But just keep him away from the mages, and there won't be a problem. ...that is, if you saved a Hinata among the many you've sacrificed to the alter of Fury, you monster. Rating: 6/10 Hinata is bulky for an Infantry Sword, which isn't bad. But his low Speed and Resistance makes it impossible for him to deal with any kind of mages, and his base kit is not as designed for dealing with his color advantages as the other Fates characters who received Gem weapons. He can be used as a bulky sword even still though. Think Arden, if Arden had better Speed/Resistance and worse HP/Atk/Def, but could have a nature and wasn't an Armor unit. Edited June 12, 2018 by Xenomata Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hilda Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 (edited) Hinata: 7/10. With the addition of Safeguard+ Guard 3 and Steady Breath and Quick Riposte seal Hinata +10 can boast a Defense of 59 pre any kind of outside buffs. He can deal with any physical threat. He looses against Dragons, mages and Felicia but thats what Teammates are there for. Ryoma: mmm 7.5/10 Edited June 12, 2018 by Hilda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 Ryoma - The original light-and-fast DC guy, who was somewhat of a pain to deal with when Vantage was active. A good Brave Bow to the face solves that problem, but I digress. His bulk is low enough that certain blue mages one-shot him (like neutral Ishtar with her default skill set). He should be able to safely tank green, as long as Gunnthra hasn't hit him. Offensively, he's just one speed off of Lucina, which is pretty good for someone with innate DC. Speaking of, the fact that it's his weapon means that he's free to grab something better for his A slot. Low bulk means he probably won't use DC to its fullest, but he's still pretty good offensively. 7.5/10 Hinata - He features not one, but TWO dump stats! You'd think this would make the other three amazing, but alas. His Atk is mediocre, which leaves sky-high physical bulk. He should be able to tank physical green and red, and possibly some blues with low attack power. With Safeguard+, a Def refine, and his innate Fury, he can tank every single vanilla physical hero on their initiation. He probably won't hurt them back, but being able to stand up to that kind of abuse is kinda impressive. 6.5/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexmender Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 The FE16 craziness really distracted me for a while. Oh well, time to see how good the next two units are. Ryoma. The original In-built DC user. Ryoma has a pretty good offensive spread with 34 Atk and 35 Spd. His Prf weapon Raijinto allows him to counter every unit regardless of range. His Hp and Def are relatively average which coupled with his high Spd allow him to survive at least 1 hit from archers. His main problem is that his Res is too low which gives him a lot of trouble against dragons and mages, also the rise of Firesweep bow means that his DC weapon isn't as useful as it used to be. Without his Prf he's a bit worse than Hana in terms of sheer stats so he has to rely on his niche to be competitive. Overall Ryoma is a pretty strong unit but his age is starting to show a bit, don't underestimate him though as he's still capable of doing a lot of damage if you're not prepared. Rating: 7/10 Hinata. He's a funny one. HIs stat spread make him basically a red Lukas, thanks to his high Hp/Atk/Def making him perfect for Enemy Phase builds. The release of Safeguard+ make him even more tanky and on a Defense tile even Lancers will have a pretty hard time taking him out. His Def also lets him fire a extremely dangerous Ignis/Bonfire so one has to rely on dragons/mages to take him down. His pathetic Res and Spd are his main weaknesses although his Spd can be considered a strength because it allows him to charge his specials faster thanks to being doubled. Overall Hinata is a pretty strong unit, but he is even better as fodder which explains why it's rare to see him in competitive play as Fury is too valuable of a skill. Rating: 7/10. He's 11/10 as fodder though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zapp Branniglenn Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 Ryoma - I don't have this guy but I've got some DC swordies like anybody else does. Completely power creeped by his legendary self with only one point of res and no weakness to arrows to show for it. Legendary Ryoma also has easier access to buffs as a flier and can provide extra attack to other heroes equipped with a water blessing. Ryoma's not bad, but barely competitive compared to modern picks 5.5 out of 10. Hinata - The physically bulkiest infantry sword unit in the game making him a rare excellent case for the Slaying Sword - since most other good slaying sword users have their own, better personal weapon. 47 HP is also among the highest HP stats of non armor units. Only Bartre beats it. Hinata is a great tank with a still decent 32 attack. Not much more to say about him. Viable but not a crazy good niche since armor units have even better stats and DC weapons. There's also no reason to field a completely infantry team unless you're interested in Infantry Pulse of which Hinata is a great user of. 4.5 out of 10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordFrigid Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 Ryoma Offense-focused stat line featuring good Atk and Spd, mediocre Def, and low Res. Raijinto (built-in Distant Counter) is a powerful defensive tool. Strong green, mediocre red matchups on offense with a standard Swift Sparrow/Life and Death offense set. He lacks a one-round special activation to break through physically bulky foes, and while his Spd is good, he falls short of doubling a lot of reds. Very strong green, decent red matchups on defense with a Steady Breath set. With a bit of Spd-boosting support, he can capably avoid follow up attacks from enemies (barring a follow-up guaranteeing effect), allowing him to get a one-round activation on a 4-charge special. Due to his lower defenses, he does take a lot of damage from reds, and green mages. He cannot provide much team support beyond the standard field/combat buff. Overall, I give him 7.5 for combat (very strong green, decent red matchups on defense), and .5 for support (basic field/combat buff), for a total rating of 7/10. It's a pity that he's become outclassed on offense, fortunately built-in Distant Counter combos nicely with Steady Breath. Now if only I had more Steady Breath fodder... Hinata Physically bulky stat line featuring high HP, good Def, decent Atk, poor Spd, and very poor Res. Poor matchups on offense due to his poor Spd stat. He can run an Atk-stacking Brave Sword set, but not very effectively. Very strong one-range red and green matchups with a Slaying Edge/Bonfire/Steady Breath set. He will take a lot of damage from dragons, however. He could use Distant Counter, but his Res is not well-suited for the job. Good Panic Ploy capability with his high HP stat. Overall, I give him 7 for combat (very strong one-range red and green matchups on defense; docked a bit for not being able to counterattack at range), and 1 for support (basic field/combat buff, Panic Ploy capability), for a total rating of 6.5/10. I wonder a little if I'm not docking enough for units with only one-range matchups (in general, since I've reduced scores by about this much for the same reason before). On the other hand, his one-range matchups are really quite solid. ~ Scoring method: Spoiler Units are evaluated based on both their combat performance and their team support capabilities (i.e. their whole contribution to a team). Combat performance is judged by matchups, especially against enemies that are at triangle disadvantage or neutral to the unit. Performance against more relevant meta threats is more valuable than performance against units that are rarely seen. Triangle Adept sets are not considered, though they might be noted. Scale of 0 to 10. Sustainability and filling a useful niche are given small bonuses, when applicable. I will look at least one PP-focused and one EP-focused skill set for each unit, but only evaluate based on performance for whichever phase I deem the unit to be stronger on. Support capabilities are decided by how much support a unit can provide (without horribly compromising their combat capabilities), and how valuable I feel that support is. Scale of 0 to 3. At the end, the combat and support scores will be weighted (with a heavy focus on combat performance), combined, and rounded to the nearest .5 to obtain the total rating. Dancers and Singers will get +1 point to their total rating (not to exceed 10), because I value Dance/Sing utility highly. This method of evaluation essentially compares each unit to a hypothetical "god unit" who is stellar at everything, instead of each unit to each other. All my ratings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Emblem Fan Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 (edited) I'll have to pass on Ryoma, I haven't summoned him. Hinata: The only things he really has going for him are tons of physical bulk and Fury fodder. Otherwise, he's outclassed by many other swordsman/women. He's very easy to take down in the mage-heavy meta, and there's still other sword people with better bulk. But you can still make use of his bulk, slap a few new skills on him and maybe give him a new weapon and low-cooling special, and you have a good physical wall! 5/10 Edited June 13, 2018 by Fire Emblem Fan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiki Posted June 13, 2018 Author Share Posted June 13, 2018 Ryoma: 6.92 Hinata: 6.14 Ryoma having less than 7. bothers me to no end (even though it is just 0.08 difference). Hana, Focused Samurai Spoiler Max. Stats: 34/37/41 32/35/38 33/36/39 20/23/26 22/26/29 Base Skills: Armorslayer+ Rally Attack ( - ) Life and Death Obstruct ( - ) Laslow, Dancing Duelist Spoiler Max. Stats: 41/44/47 32/35/38 23/26/30 27/30/33 19/22/25 Base Skills: Silver Sword+ ( - ) Noontime ( - ) Axebreaker Hone Spd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverly Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 Hana: A very underrated sword unit and one of the few units not to suffer from launch-date syndrome. She has very great offenses with mediocre defenses, so she’s built to be an all-out attacker. When used correctly, she’ll be a great asset, especially since she’s fairly easy to obtain and merge. She’s held back due to not having a legendary weapon and you need to plan her matchups carefully, but when used correctly she’ll be quite good. 8/10 Laslow: Poor guy. He doesn’t have a lot going for him. His attack, HP, and defenses are alright, but the same cannot be said for his speed and resistance. He could be used as a defensive unit, but he’s pretty outclassed there especially by the likes of Ike, Hinata, and so forth. In the end, he’s just another sword unit. 4/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexmender Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 Hana. She's one of the few min-maxed launch units and a very good one at that. 35/36 offenses is nothing to scoof at and while her bulk is mediocre it is good enough to survive at least 1 hit. Despite being a one trick pony she's very good at it, just max her offenses and let her destroy the enemy. She can run a Brave Sword, Wo Dao, Slaying Edge or Firesweep Sword and perform pretty well with each of them. Her main problem is that she faces direct competition from Soleil who boasts higher Atk (and BST) in exchange of 1 point of Spd which more often than not is a non-factor. Her lack of a Prf also makes her pale in comparison to Ayra/Mia who have the same role and she also struggles a bit against Fir/Karel who tend to have higher damage bursts thanks to their Prf. Karla, the newest adition to the sword family plainly outclasses her statwise. Hana is still a great unit and extremely powerful when built properly but she really needs a unique weapon to set her apart. Rating: 6/10 Laslow. Take Chrom, reduce his Hp/Atk/Def to increase his Spd/Res a bit and you have Laslow. As you can see Laslow is just an inferior Chrom as he's less min-maxed in the areas he should focus on. He works fine as a offensive Brave Sword user thanks to his high Atk but that's about it, he's outclassed by Hinata as a physical tank and by Chrom in every other role thanks to Chrom being more min-maxed. The guy is pretty decent so using him if he's one of your favorites won't cause you any trouble but know that there are better swords out there. Rating: 4/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hilda Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 19 hours ago, Fire Emblem Fan said: I'll have to pass on Ryoma, I haven't summoned him. Hinata: The only things he really has going for him are tons of physical bulk and Fury fodder. Otherwise, he's outclassed by many other swordsman/women. He's very easy to take down in the mage-heavy meta, and there's still other sword people with better bulk. But you can still make use of his bulk, slap a few new skills on him and maybe give him a new weapon and low-cooling special, and you have a good physical wall! 5/10 the meta isnt mage heavy at all in whale wonder land, so he can fit in there perfectly. I agree on lower Tiers, but in higher tiers like in 5200+ range Hinata is a better choice then most melees, just because he basicly takes 0 dmg and fires back immensly with a Steady Breath/Guard/Quick Riposte Seal/Ignis. Patch him up with a Marth that can heal (if its even needed, my Lukas barely needs any heals when i pick him + a healer out to deal with a Armor Emblem Team not involving Grima) him back up constantly and boost his def even further and you have indestructable wall. I mean we are talking about 73 Defense in that setup with safeguard! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordFrigid Posted June 14, 2018 Share Posted June 14, 2018 Hana Offense-focused stat line with good Atk and Spd, mediocre Res, and low Def. She has numerous options for Player Phase sets. Wo Dao+/Moonbow/Desperation/Heavy Blade (seal) gives her consistent, strong green and decent red performance. A Brave Sword does well against greens, but is shaky on reds, and will falter in the face of higher-Def ones. Using a Firesweep S+ will lower her KO counts, but prevent enemies from counterattacking her; she can then take Swordbreaker for strong green and decent red matchups. Her stat line is not well-suited to a defensive set. She cannot provide much team support beyond the standard C passive field/combat buff. Overall, I give her 7.5 for combat (strong green, decent red matchups on offense with a Wo Dao+ set, sustainability bonus), and .5 for support (basic field/combat buff), for a total rating of 7/10. Hana is pretty similar to Ogma, offensively, and her matchups generally reflected that. I think having her end up half a point above him is about right, those 2 extra Spd points really do help her. Laslow Stat-line with a physical emphasis, with good Atk, decent Def, and low Spd and Res. Fairly capable with an Atk-stacking Brave Sword, but has difficulty with enemies that have high physical bulk. Very strong green and strong red one-range matchups with a Slaying Edge/Steady Breath set. He does take a decent chunk of damage from swords and dragons. He can provide Panic Ploy support for his team with his good HP stat. Overall, I give him 6.5 for combat (very strong green, strong red one-range matchups with a Slaying Edge/Steady Breath set, but cannot counter at range), and 1 for support (basic field/combat buff, Panic Ploy capability), for a total rating of 6/10. I would say his defense set is quite comparable to Hinata's, but with more damage taken. As a result, his performance (most notably in the red department) was weaker. ~ Scoring method: Spoiler Units are evaluated based on both their combat performance and their team support capabilities (i.e. their whole contribution to a team). Combat performance is judged by matchups, especially against enemies that are at triangle disadvantage or neutral to the unit. Performance against more relevant meta threats is more valuable than performance against units that are rarely seen. Triangle Adept sets are not considered, though they might be noted. Scale of 0 to 10. Sustainability and filling a useful niche are given small bonuses, when applicable. I will look at least one PP-focused and one EP-focused skill set for each unit, but only evaluate based on performance for whichever phase I deem the unit to be stronger on. Support capabilities are decided by how much support a unit can provide (without horribly compromising their combat capabilities), and how valuable I feel that support is. Scale of 0 to 3. At the end, the combat and support scores will be weighted (with a heavy focus on combat performance), combined, and rounded to the nearest .5 to obtain the total rating. Dancers and Singers will get +1 point to their total rating (not to exceed 10), because I value Dance/Sing utility highly. This method of evaluation essentially compares each unit to a hypothetical "god unit" who is stellar at everything, instead of each unit to each other. All my ratings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Emblem Fan Posted June 14, 2018 Share Posted June 14, 2018 Hana: A surprisingly decent unit, overall. She's not amazing, but she's pretty good. With very good attack and speed, she can dish out a ton of damage, and if you give her a skill like Fury and a Brave weapon, she can hit hard consecutively and leave her opponent crippled or outright defeated. However, she has bad defense and resistance, so she can't really stand more than a single hit, and she doesn't have a fancy personal weapon to help her out. But that's not too much of a drawback, that's mostly how glass canons are supposed to be, right? 6/10 Laslow: He's like Hana in that he's surprisingly okay. His speed isn't particularly good, but neither is it terrible. His attack and defense are great, with his only truly bad stat being his resistance. Still, he doesn't have things like amazing synergy or something he truly EXCELS at to set him apart, he's just kinda there in a sea of red swords. 6/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenomata Posted June 14, 2018 Share Posted June 14, 2018 Damn, this game had a lot of Infantry Swords at launch... no wonder they took the chance to make Raven an axe user... Hana Spoiler Hana's been more blessed than some other units at launch, with not just good Attack and Speed, but also natural access to the then rare Life and Death skill, albeit at 5*.rarity. Her Defense, Resistance, and HP aren't good enough to consider tanking, but it more or less compliments her role as a glass cannon. Her default weapon is decent enough, given her higher than most units Attack to net KOs against Green Armors, but she could still consider running a different weapon, most of which she runs pretty well with. Like most other Infantry Sword though, she runs into the problem of being outclassed by newer units. But most especially, she is an Infantry Sword with offensive-based stats and almost no defense, meaning she has to net the kill or risk being killed. Defense being her lowest stat, as well as not great HP, makes surviving one hit a lot harder than it should be, and running Pavise/Escutcheon means sacrificing damage from a Special trigger. I won't say she's bad, even among all the other Swords we've gotten since launch. Her combination of power and speed, as well as natural access to Life and Death 3, makes her a lot better than many other sword units right now. But it hurts that she can't take all that powerful a hit, even if she is able to avoid being doubled. Rating: 6.5/10 Hana is blessed with good Attack and Speed, and low Defense. Resistance, and HP. This is good for a glass cannon, but it also means that any hit she does take will hurt a lot. Hana needs to pick her battles, or else she will not last long. Lazlow Spoiler Lazlow feels like a worse Chrom. His Attack and Defense are both lower than Chrom, and his Speed, while slightly better, still isn't high enough that many would go out of their way to get a +Spd Lazlow. Worse HP also means Lazlow's Infantry Pulse/Panic Ploy game is worse than Chroms, and all those Growth Points were put into Resistance, which is still too low to be able to use effectively. Lazlow isn't bad though. He is able to run with a Brave Sword better than most other units, and his Speed, while not high, can still be redeemed if invested into. His Defense is solid enough that he can run a defensive build, and he is still able to run Infantry Pulse and Panic Ploy better than most other units. A budget Lazlow can still be used as an Axe counter, thanks to his decent Attack, Silver Sword, and Axebreaker, in a meta where Axe users are generally frightening if not fought properly. I will not try to be too harsh on Lazlow, as I've yet to ever even see him in Arena, let alone built him. He's a worse Chrom, but he can still be used if you really want to. Rating: 5/10 Lazlow doesn't quite match up to most other Swords, having low Speed and average Defense, with Attack that, while good, doesn't do him a lot of good if he can only hit once. Building on his Attack via a Brave Sword can produce results, however. I ultimately feel like he's just a worse Chrom, with potential growth being put into a Resistance that still isn't high enough to consider using. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ae†her Posted June 14, 2018 Share Posted June 14, 2018 How do people give Ryoma less than a 7? Anyways Hana - Amazing offensive spread of 34/36, and some decent Res, and HP after a obtaining a refined weapon. She can be built as a speedy, but squishy sword unit who also hits hard, which is always valuable. She's going to get outclassed by a lot of the newer swords that are coming out, but that doesn't mean she is of no value. I give her a 7/10 for combat. In terms of skills and skill inheritance, she has armorslayer which can be useful for her, and if you build her up to +10 and give her DC she's going to have a lot of Spd and Res, but not a lot of Defense against armors, so armorslayer helps take care of that to some degree. Life and Death 3 can be found on her, but it's locked at 5 stars. The only other person who spawns in 4 star rarity is Sothe, who can give it to you in 4* rarity unlike Hana, however, Sothe is super rare. I give Hana a 7/10 for Skill Inheritance. 7/10 Laslow - He has a rather interesting and mixed statline. He can be built somewhat speedy (in the sense that he can mitigate follow-ups from mediocre fast units) and tanky, or just tanky and hard hitting. He has a decent 35 Atk, and some good HP so it's not like he doesn't have combat potential, it's just that he needs to built with a lot of expensive things to start being useful. He's like a Donnel stat-wise, but with less BST. 6/10 for combat. Skill inheritance: he has Axebreaker 3 at 4* rarity. That's it. Not very helpful. 4/10 5.8/10 ~> 6/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zapp Branniglenn Posted June 14, 2018 Share Posted June 14, 2018 (edited) Hana - For Hana's sake I had been waiting for a Firesweep sword to be added into the game. And it came on the character that mildly powercreeps her. Hana still has a single point of speed over Soleil, but she won't score as high in arena or hit as hard. The 35/36 offensive spread is also just no longer top of the line for sword units and she can't score as high as any notable sword users either. 5.5 out of 10. Still viable for sure, but not ideal in this rating system. Laslow - Take Hinata, drop his physical bulk and spend it on Res and three points of attack. Laslow has been left behind. A 35 attack brave sword user can't cut it in today's meta and he'll never wield a slaying sword or tank as well as hinata. 3 out of 10. Past Ratings Spoiler Alfonse - 3 Marth - 7 Sharena - 3 Jagen - 1 Anna - 4.5 Barst - 3 Cain - 4 Draug - 7.5 Gordin - 5 Jeorge - 5.5 Abel - 5.5 Linde - 9 Minerva - Abstain Merric - 3.5 Maria - 6 Wrys - 3.5 Ceada - Abstain Ogma - 4 Catria - 4 Est - 6 Sheena - 6.5 Cecilia - 4 Clarine - 6.5 Matthew - 4 Palla - 2.5 Roy -7 Gwendolyn - 7.5 Shanna - 4.5 Bartre - 7 Fae - 7.5 Serra - 4 Lissa - 2 Y!Tiki - 8 Lilina - 7 Florina - 1.5 M!Robin - 3.5 Hector - 8 Raven - 8.5 Gaius - 4 Virion - 3.5 Raigh - 1.5 Sophia - 3.5 Sully -2.5 Cordelia -7 Hawkeye - 5.5 Nino - 8 Felicia - 6.5 Jakob - 1 Fir - 4 Eliwood - 5.5 Donnel - 3.5 Nowi - 8.5 Frederick - 6.5 Cherche - 7.5 Saizo - 4 Kagero - 4.5 Lyn - 7 Chrom - 5 F!Corrin - 7 Azura - 6.5 Gunter - 3 Camilla - 5.5 Azama - 6.5 Setsuna - 3.5 Stahl - 2.5 Lonqu - 3 Hinoka - 7.5 Oboro - 2.5 Beruka - 6 Arthur - 2 Takumi - 5.5 Sakura - 3 Olivia - 7 Henry - 2 Subaki - 4.5 Peri - 6.5 Niles - 1.5 Elise - 7.5 Tharja - 5 A!Tiki - 8 Odin - 1 Effie - 7.5 Lucina - 7 M!Corrin - 6 Ryoma - 5.5 Hinata - 4.5 Hana - 5.5 Laslow - 3 Ratings I would change in retrospect: Gordin would be a 2.5, Cain would be a 3.5, Linde would be 7. Nowi would be an 8. And I'd drop Matthew and Saizo to 3.5. Beruka would be a 7. Caeda I'd rate a 6 now that I've been using her at 5 star. Edited June 14, 2018 by Glennstavos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiki Posted June 14, 2018 Author Share Posted June 14, 2018 Hana: 6.57 Laslow: 4.86 Selena, Cutting Wit Spoiler Max. Stats: 34/37/41 22/25/29 32/35/38 29/32/35 24/28/31 Base Skills: Armorslayer+ Reposition ( - ) Triangle Adept ( - ) Threaten Spd Leo, Sorcerous Prince Spoiler Max. Stats: 35/39/42 25/29/32 19/22/25 22/25/29 26/30/33 Base Skills: Brynhildr ( If unit initiates combat, inflicts status on foe restricting movement to 1 space through its next action. ) RIP ( - ) Blazing Light ( - ) Quick Riposte Savage Blow After this round we will start with Banners, rejoice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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