Rath vs Rebecca

[DisobeyedCargo]

How do the two compar. Who overall performs better. Rath has a mount and high move, and Rebecca has great speed and dodging ability. I'm torn on who to take through the game 

Edited May 16, 2018 by DisobeyedCargo

[indigoasis]

2 minutes ago, DisobeyedCargo said:

How do the two compare. Who overall performs better. Seth has a mount and high move, and Rebecca has great speed and dodging ability. I'm torn on who to take through the game 

I wish Seth was in FE7.

Anyway, go with Rebecca. You recruit her early, so she has plenty of time to train. Her speed growth is also really good, so she'll be able to double almost any enemy. If you keep all the units in your army together, she should be fine.

Rath rejoins pretty late and underleveled compared to the rest of the army at the point he's rerecruited, but if you're interested in using an mounted archer, there's nothing stopping you. There's an arena not too far off, so if you want to get him caught up, then that will be the best oppurtunity.

[Mandokarla]

3rd Option: Don't use an archer in FE7 -- only 2x effective damage combined with low stats and no 1-2 range means they are just not really good. But if you are determined to use an archer, I recommend Rath for two reasons: Mounts = good by default, and he gets swords on Promotion. He also gets hard mode bonuses I think

[Shiki]

1 hour ago, DisobeyedCargo said:

How do the two compar. Who overall performs better. Seth has a mount and high move, and Rebecca has great speed and dodging ability. I'm torn on who to take through the game 

You commited sacrilege by comparing Seth with this insignificant wench.

Anyway for Rath it depends on if you did Lyn Mode. Without Lyn Mode he starts with a B Rank in Bows which allows him to use the Brave Bow from the Dragon's Gate. This compensates his rather bad bases at that point and gives him respectable offense against those Wyvern Riders and mages. Plus having a mount gives him more flexibility.
If you did Lyn Mode he is quite a bit worse but this game offers enough opportunities to raise some underleveled units and Rath is better than some other cases ... like Rebecca.

Rebecca is one of the worst units in the game. Her bases are super bad but I assume you somehow trained her, considering you praise her "great Spd"; she is still an infantry unit that can only attack in the Player Phase 80% of the time. By the point where you can choose between these two you have so many other units you could use over her.
If you didn't promote her then I recommend to skip it because you get a much better Sniper later on who does everything that Rebecca does.

So if you have to train a Bow unit then I suggest Rath.

Edited May 16, 2018 by The Priest

[DisobeyedCargo]

30 minutes ago, The Priest said:

You commited sacrilege by comparing Seth with this insignificant wench.

Anyway for Rath it depends on if you did Lyn Mode. Without Lyn Mode he starts with a B Rank in Bows which allows him to use the Brave Bow from the Dragon's Gate. This compensates his rather bad bases at that point and gives him respectable offense against those Wyvern Riders and mages. Plus having a mount gives him more flexibility.
If you did Lyn Mode he is quite a bit worse but this game offers enough opportunities to raise some underleveled units and Rath is better than some other cases ... like Rebecca.

Rebecca is one of the worst units in the game. Her bases are super bad but I assume you somehow trained her, considering you praise her "great Spd"; she is still an infantry unit that can only attack in the Player Phase 80% of the time. By the point where you can choose between these two you have so many other units you could use over her.
If you didn't promote her then I recommend to skip it because you get a much better Sniper later on who does everything that Rebecca does.

So if you have to train a Bow unit then I suggest Rath.

Oof why did I type Seth?

im also just beating Lyn mode now.

Edited May 16, 2018 by DisobeyedCargo

[De Geso]

Rebecca is toilet, if you must use a bow user take Rath. If you play Eliwood or Hector mode without playing Lyn mode he has great bow rank + decent bases, and if you used him in Lyn Mode he'll also be pretty strong. Still, as @Mandokarla recommended I wouldn't take either one as bows are pretty bad in FE7.

I can't be bothered to do a breakdown of the numbers but the availability gap doesn't really affect just how much worse Rebecca is than Rath, it's really not close lol

Edited May 16, 2018 by YouSquiddinMe

[ProfImpossible]

It depends, 

Rath is harder to train considering you have to use him like crazy in Lyn mode if you want him to be good right when you get him later. Whereas you have more time to baby Rebbeca through. My personal opinion is that Rebecca is easier to use, but Rath is ultimately more viable late game. Rebecca can be as good if not better than Luise but she's still just a sniper.

Rebecca's not Oswin level by any means, but still undeserving of the sentiments expressed here. Perhaps The RNG has always been kinder to me though.

[Von Ithipathachai]

Yeah.  Rebecca is really only good for early-game chip damage and that's about it.

I would consider using Rath or even Wil over her, she's that bad.  I've also heard good things about Geitz as a possible primary Bow user.

[Florete]

A trained Rath is better or equal in almost everything and takes less effort to get there, plus he gets swords, a horse, and lots of Aid.

[Interdimensional Observer]

If you'd like hard numbers, I'll throw up 20/10 averages, just for some idea how they compare.

Rebecca:

HP 37.8

Str 18.2

Skl 20

Spd 23.8

Lck 18

Def 9.2

Res 11.4

 Con is 5, 6 promoted.

Rath:

HP 45.6

Str 21

Skl 18.8

Spd 22

Lck 11.6

Def 12.2

Res 10.5

Con is 7/8 (strangely Rath has 8 Con in Lyn Mode, he loses a point afterwards)

And here is Wil, just because:

HP 43.25

Str 20.5

Skl 20.5

Spd 17.8

Lck 16.8

Def 12.4

Res 9.75

Con is 6/7.

I'll leave out Geitz and Louise, the other two good bow users. Just know that Louise has shabby stats by comparison, 4 less Str than Rebecca the weakest of the bunch at 20/10 for example, but she requires no investment at all to use. Geitz is as strong as the guys, but slower, albeit with more Con and Axes access, which is good.

For Bow Wt: Iron 5, Steel 9, Killer 7, Silver 6, Longbow 10, Killer 7, and Brave is 12. Steel will always be a burden on Rebecca, particularly at the beginning when she isn't fast at all, Rath can handle it better.

 

Overall, I think this makes it clear that Rath > Rebecca on average. More Str, Con, concrete durability, and also Sword use on promotion and a horse all the time. A little extra, excessive Spd, and Skl, Lck, and Res don't matter all that much. Wil is sadly an inferior Rath.

But as always, use whoever you want, what is fun for you, and that your personal experience may vary.

 

Edit: I'll throw up Geitz's 20/10 Normal averages, since he is being called quite good

HP 45.95

Str 20.5

Skl 14.1

Spd 15.8

Lck 12.8

Def 12.4

Res 4.4

Has 13 Con. To the above stats, on Hard add 1 or 2 points to every stat not HP (add like 4 there).

So less accurate than the others, but enemies aren't very dodgy in FE7, doesn't matter much. Spd, well against like a Hero or Nomad Trooper or Valkyrie it'll hurt, but against most mooks, 16 is more than sufficient. And if you really need to double them, well hey look Mom- AS-loss free Brave Bow use! Terrible Res, but that is bearable (but I guess it gives Hawkeye a niche over Geitz).

Edited May 18, 2018 by Interdimensional Observer

[Slumber]

Rath. He's not the best ever, but he's good enough.

Even if you manage to get Rebecca up to a comparable level to him by his recruitment, she'll be far behind in stats. There was an argument somewhere recently, and I think somebody pointed out that Rebecca needs to be at level 14 to compare to Rath at base. That's a lot of preferential treatment you'll need to give Rebecca, as Archers level very slowly. Her niche also falls off very quickly, as her damage output isn't good enough to keep up after her early game chipping, which won't help with the slow leveling Archers face.

But as mentioned, Getiz is probably the best Bow user in the game if you're conflicted about putting effort into one. Starts with a B rank in bows, starts with stats comparable to Rath at a similar level(He'll lag in speed a bit, but his massive con will allow him to wield any bow without penalty, though Rath will only ever suffer from a single point on Steel bows, 4 on the Brave Bow, and 2 on Longbows, so it's not the biggest deal). Hard Mode Geitz is even more of a no-brainer. While he doesn't sound amazing on paper, just remember that he joins immediately ready to use not too much later than Rath, and he can freely swap between Axes and Bows of nearly any rank. No need to grind up a weapon rank like Rath's swords to have better close range options.

Edited May 17, 2018 by Slumber

[Florete]

Yeah of all the units who come with bows Geitz is definitely the best. Like Geitz >> Rath >> Louise > Rebecca > Wil. Which means Geitz is at least 4 '>'s better than Louise, the best Sniper.

But if it's really just about Rath or Rebecca, then yeah, Rath.

[SMEDIA]

I’ve never played through the Hard difficulties, but here’s what I’ve noticed:

Rath is a very good unit for the entire game. When it comes to supports, I pair him up with Lyn since you’re required to use her on the last chapter anyway, and having her stick close Rath so he gets some stat bonuses is good strategy. I’m a big fan of the Nomad Trooper/Ranger class of FE7 and 8.

Rebecca is much better than Wil, but that’s not saying much...

Also, I enjoy using the Brave and long bows, so having one bow user on your team will grant some flexibility.

[Just call me AL]

8 hours ago, SMEDIA said:

Rath is a very good unit for the entire game. When it comes to supports, I pair him up with Lyn since you’re required to use her on the last chapter anyway, and having her stick close Rath so he gets some stat bonuses is good strategy.

Rath doesn't need a support with Lyn to function. Nor would he have the opportunity to build a support with her, realistically. Just saying.

[Florete]

1 hour ago, Just call me AL said:

Rath doesn't need a support with Lyn to function. Nor would he have the opportunity to build a support with her, realistically. Just saying.

They may not reach A until pretty late, but 17/20/20 turns for C/B/A isn't that bad.

[Just call me AL]

14 hours ago, Florete said:

They may not reach A until pretty late, but 17/20/20 turns for C/B/A isn't that bad.

I'm not saying otherwise. But seeing as Supports are a two-way street, I feel like Lyn has better options on hand.

[Ansem]

Rath has a mount and can reliably kill things. Once you promote him, he has an existent enemy phase.

Why is this a thread? 

[Dark Holy Elf]

On 5/17/2018 at 12:59 AM, Florete said:

Yeah of all the units who come with bows Geitz is definitely the best. Like Geitz >> Rath >> Louise > Rebecca > Wil. Which means Geitz is at least 4 '>'s better than Louise, the best Sniper.

But if it's really just about Rath or Rebecca, then yeah, Rath.

Eh, I feel Louise is a bit underrated here. She has a free A support with Pent so that's essentially +1 might / +15 hit / + 7 avo  / +3 def/res right there (and importantly, ALSO improves Pent by that much, who isn't likely to get a support otherwise), and she also starts with an A in bows, which helps offset her low power by being able to pull out Silver against anyone who needs it. I dunno that I consider her as good as Geitz or Rath but she's more competitive with them that she is with Rebecca/Wil IMO.

[Gaado]

Rath has a mount and doesn't start out with crap stats. Even if you do not train him in Lyn's Mode, he joins relatively close to level 10 with almost no competition for an Orion Bolt. If you let him chip for a few maps, he can promote at like lvl 10-13 by Louise's join time. By promotion then, he gains 1 range access and can utilize the Brave Bow, which helps shore up a lot of damage issues he can have from early promotion. 

Is he going to wreck face? No - pretty much no archer in FE will do that without extreme favoritism and a slow down of pace. 

[X-Naut]

Rath is the best bow user in the game, Rebecca is tied with Wil for worst. GBA Archer/Nomad balance is awful.

[Reality]

3 hours ago, X-Naut said:

Rath is the best bow user in the game, Rebecca is tied with Wil for worst. GBA Archer/Nomad balance is awful.

I feel like roleplaying with dorcas,  bartre, and geitz without axes  would still work technically outclass them, even with the likely E-D weapon rank max. Having a strength stat cabable of leveling up  is just better for the archers statline than double tinking.

[Dark Holy Elf]

I'm not going to defend Wil/Rebecca here but this is FE7, the game where average enemy defences even at the end of the game hover around ~10 (and of the two non-boss enemy types who do notably better, archers hit weakness on one). Tinking isn't a problem.

Also Bartre is almost as bad as Wil/Rebecca with his "can't even double soldiers" base speed.

[Rose482]

Rebecca all the way

[Rose482]

And when will the war on archers ends ;; ? 

[Tsak]

Rath easily
hardly even a contest based on my ancedotal evidence

I've had Rath come in clutch a few times on a few playthroughs. I've had Rebecca soak experience for days and feel bad. Hell lyn might be a better archer then Rebecca (not running the numbers or defending this just saying it's a testament on how bad Rebecca feels)

Rebecca can be useful for chipping in the first couple of chapters, but she's fairly useless once you start picking units and benching people she's one of the first to go for me always. Doesn't help that archers aren't very good in this game.
Rath can be used to rescue things, manages to get swords on promotion and you can pimp him out on lyn mode if you so desire. Even if you don't do Lyn mode his bases on hard are solid.