General JRPG Topic

[Tamanoir]

4 minutes ago, Armagon said:

It's less of a criticism and more of just how i feel about the series as a whole. I will admit that it wasn't the best choice of words but basically, i don't feel anything interesting coming out of the series. It lacks that "hook" for me. FF13's sci-fi setting probably would've interested me but i hear the game is a steaming pile of garbage so....

I've heard Tempest is awful but i still don't know why. All i've heard is that it's the worst Tales game, much worse than Zestiria and Dawn of a New World (the two games that i hear get shit on but still has it's fans).

FF games often have a more futuristic setting than most, especially since FF6. They are often quite different from one title to another, so it may be worth checking more.

I don't know lots about Zestiria, or Dawn of a New World, but I guess teh complaints must be about story, characters or thing like that.
For Tempest, it's easy : the presentation is pretty terrible. I tried the ranslation a few years ago, and didn't played much, but what I remember is that the sound effects were terrible and outdated. And it's quite clunky overall.
Now, the story and character may be totally worth it, for all I know. But it's simply not very appealing.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

40 minutes ago, Tamanoir said:

FF games often have a more futuristic setting than most, especially since FF6. They are often quite different from one title to another, so it may be worth checking more.

Actually FF4 is where I'd say it became explicit. One of the vehicles is a hovercraft for crossing shallow waters. The underworld features dwarves with battle tanks. There's the Tower of Babil where you fight a Frankenstein's Monster analogue. The story between Cecil and Golbez is ripped completely from the Darth Vader/Luke Skywalker dynamic. And the finale takes place on The Moon. Squaresoft loves Star Wars. That's why they put Biggs and Wedge in FF6. Even Ted Woolsey thought they went too far and tried to translate Biggs as Vicks to hide it. FF1's got some sci fi too. With what little story appears in that game you will in fact time travel to the past in order to correct a time paradox.

Final Fantasy's pretty good overall. Not a lot of stinkers. My personal, not-objective top 5 is 4 > 10 > 12 > 9 > 13. @ArmagonI think if you can handle Xenoblade Chronicles 2, you're ready for Final Fantasy 13. Very similar in my opinion. 13 is only worse in that it's side content is uncompelling and its story more confusing until you start reading the Datalog.

Edited June 18, 2018 by Glennstavos

[Armagon]

1 hour ago, Tamanoir said:

FF games often have a more futuristic setting than most, especially since FF6. They are often quite different from one title to another, so it may be worth checking more.

Hmmm. I'll take a look at it then. I probably still wouldn't do 7 though. Maybe i'll play 6.

37 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

I think if you can handle Xenoblade Chronicles 2, you're ready for Final Fantasy 13. Very similar in my opinion. 13 is only worse in that it's side content is uncompelling and its story more confusing until you start reading the Datalog.

I really don't see how. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is an amazing game, most people who have played the game agree on that. Meanwhile, i've heard nothing but bad things about Final Fantasy 13, in both story/characters and gameplay. The settings are also very different. The world of Xenoblade 2 is literally alive, with people living on or inside Titans. The world of Final Fantasy 13 is an Earth-like planet with a giant sphere floating in the sky, and that setting is more dystopian in nature.

Edited June 18, 2018 by Armagon

[Tamanoir]

4 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Hmmm. I'll take a look at it then. I probably still wouldn't do 7 though. Maybe i'll play 6.

6 is a favourite of mine, but it's one of my first JRPGs (with FF4 and Golden Sun. And Pokémon, but Pokémon is different.), so I'm probably a little biased.
Still, I appreciate the fact it doesn't really have a clear main character (Terra and Locke are important, but you can possibly finish the game without them. Celes is a main character for the second part, but she appears relatively late as well...)

Btw, do you know the Wild Arms franchise ?

 

[Armagon]

7 minutes ago, Tamanoir said:

6 is a favourite of mine, but it's one of my first JRPGs (with FF4 and Golden Sun. And Pokémon, but Pokémon is different.), so I'm probably a little biased.

Well, i've heard a lot of great things about 6 so i wouldn't blame you. Golden Sun is also another series i played. Well, only the second one (what was it called? Lost- something.) I actually do hope the Golden Sun series makes a comeback but i don't know how likely that is. Heard mixed things about Dark Dawn though.

10 minutes ago, Tamanoir said:

Btw, do you know the Wild Arms franchise ?

I don't. Heard the name before but all that comes to mind is ARMS. Why, i don't know.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

1 hour ago, Armagon said:

I really don't see how. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is an amazing game, most people who have played the game agree on that. Meanwhile, i've heard nothing but bad things about Final Fantasy 13, in both story/characters and gameplay. The settings are also very different. The world of Xenoblade 2 is literally alive, with people living on or inside Titans. The world of Final Fantasy 13 is an Earth-like planet with a giant sphere floating in the sky, and that setting is more dystopian in nature.

I didn't say FF13 is good, I'm saying it's up your alley if XC2 is your thing. You heard bad stuff about FF13 because it was overhyped, over budgeted, and most importantly Different. You cannot afford to be different in a long running franchise, even one that reinvents itself every game. Combat is extremely similar. In XC2 you can actually move around, but in Final Fantasy 13 you have complete control of your party member's AI. Both are Auto Battle centric games featuring enemies with high health bars that you need to stagger and debuff in order to do meaningful damage. I was reminded of 13 constantly while playing XC2. Two games can still be very similar despite a difference in quality. 

Edited June 18, 2018 by Glennstavos

[Modamy]

2 hours ago, Tamanoir said:

I don't know lots about Zestiria, or Dawn of a New World, but I guess teh complaints must be about story, characters or thing like that.
For Tempest, it's easy : the presentation is pretty terrible. I tried the ranslation a few years ago, and didn't played much, but what I remember is that the sound effects were terrible and outdated. And it's quite clunky overall.
Now, the story and character may be totally worth it, for all I know. But it's simply not very appealing.

I only played a bit of Tempest myself, but the gameplay was probably the worst of the entire series. Clunky, slow, and repetitive. There was no flow to the combat or combo potential outside of a basic three hit combo with the main character. Your first party member is a suicidal healer who refuses to heal you and is intent on face tanking everything the enemy throws at her so the party member ai needs to be messed around with in the tactics menu if you want them to be helpful (although that's not too different from most Tales games).

Zesty's complaints are generally about the story and gameplay. I actually like its gameplay if I'm playing as Sorey or Rose since their movesets actual feel complete. The story feels really weak and the only characters that really get any development or agency in the story are Sorey and Dezel while the rest of the party are just around with no real character arcs of their own.

I'm not sure what the issues with DoaNW are outside of the other human party members being at locked levels throughout the whole thing. I liked Emil and Marta and Emil was really fun to play with. It was also interesting to see some expansion on the demon world lore from Phantasia and Symphonia.

[Shiki]

@Glennstavos
Pretty sure that's only you.
Combat is not even remotely similar. FF13 is the definition of auto-mode (aka let it play by itself) while XB2 definetly requires active input against bosses. You need to get your timings right and in general auto-canceling is a big thing to make battles faster and easier. Battles there have real substance behind it, FF13 doesn't.
Not to mention everything else about FF13 like that awful corridor syndrome makes it even worse.

So @Armagon stay far away from FF13, unless you want to have a taste of something that a RPG shouldn't be. In fact nothing in FF really has something that makes you feel similar to Xenoblade. I guess the Battle System from the SNES and PS era could be similar to XB1 but aside from that nope.

[Armagon]

18 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

You cannot afford to be different in a long running franchise, even one that reinvents itself every game.

That's.....not entirely true. But it also is. It's weird. It just depends on how it's done and how the community takes it. 

20 minutes ago, Modamy said:

I'm not sure what the issues with DoaNW are outside of the other human party members being at locked levels throughout the whole thing. I liked Emil and Marta and Emil was really fun to play with. It was also interesting to see some expansion on the demon world lore from Phantasia and Symphonia.

I haven't played but while do hear that DoaNW gets shit on a lot, i feel like a majority of the complaints simply have to do with the game being a direct sequel to Symphonia. TOSymphonia was the "Final Fantasy 7" of the Tales series and i'm guessing many Tales fans didn't feel it lived up to the Symphonia name.

 

 

[Slumber]

3 hours ago, Armagon said:

As for Dragon Quest, the "hook" for that series is that it still follows the original JRPG formula of creating your own party from the get-go. Not many JRPGs still do that, the only ones i can think of are Etrian Odyssey and 7th Dragon (specifically the third game, i don't know about the first two).

The only DQs that let you form your own parties are 3 and 9. 1 has you as the hero, solo, and every other game has static characters who join your party. Similarly, in Final Fantasy, 1 and the original 3 also let you build a party.

Some of the DQ games let you toy with their skills and abilities, like 6 and 7, which are essentially class-bassed, but FF also has class based games(IE 5 and 12), and games like 7 and 8 have more character flexibility than any of the DQ games.

So if it's just the idea of making your own party of nameless dudes that draws you into DQ, then you might be a bit disappointed if you ever try the series out. Again, as mentioned, what makes DQ so "different" these days is how traditional of a JRPG in structure it is. It still has charming stories and fun characters, but gameplay-wise, it's as classic and normal it gets.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

17 minutes ago, The Priest said:

@Glennstavos
Pretty sure that's only you.
Combat is not even remotely similar. FF13 is the definition of auto-mode (aka let it play by itself) while XB2 definetly requires active input against bosses. You need to get your timings right and in general auto-canceling is a big thing to make battles faster and easier. Battles there have real substance behind it, FF13 doesn't.
Not to mention everything else about FF13 like that awful corridor syndrome makes it even worse.

Don't let hate blind you from the truth!

[Tryhard]

I suppose I can say that I find FF13 to be nowhere near as bad as people made it out to be.

People praised FFX for many years (I like it too), but it is just as linear as a game as FF13. They both follow a similar structure actually, opening up when you get to Gran Pulse and the Calm Lands respectively and yet that is one of the main complaints with FF13.

Edited June 18, 2018 by Tryhard

[Interdimensional Observer]

14 hours ago, Armagon said:

Me saying that Final Fantasy feels basic to me despite Xenogears, one of my favorite games ever, originally being conceived as a potential FF7 is ironic. Then again, Xenogears told a story very different compared to previous FF games at the time.

 

There is one thing VII and XG have in common, a hero with psychological issues. The difference in how they are handled is significant however, Cloud's is certainly less dark and complicated. And whereas Fei is a hesitant self-deprecating weakling for most of XG (insofar as I remember it), Cloud starts as a badass, though this does change when the psyche truth comes to light and weakens him.

Cloud isn't bad though. He, in FFVII itself, is a good enough character, he just requires less to understand than Fei and has that appeal to that shallow, yet charming trait of badass.

 

14 hours ago, DragonFlames said:

Same with Seymour's final battle theme (creatively titled "Seymour Battle Theme") from FFX. I know that theme is widely beloved, but it's kind of "meh" to me.

 

It's too... Electronic Dance Music I guess? The first version I heard was the HD Remaster revamp. I want to like it, but it falls flat for me. I can also see Seymour getting whipped, with ecstasy on his blindfolded face, to it.

Which reminds me, why did he never just say to Yuna  "I want to marry you in hopes our bond with become strong enough that I'll be your Final Aeon"? That would have resolved a great issue of the marriage insofar as everyone save Tidus sees it- that it distracts from the pilgrimage. I'm sure everyone would be happy to know that somebody was willing to be sacrificed instead of them too. The one remaining issue would be Yuna's willingness to consent to the marriage. All Seymour had to do is leave out the "Because I want to become Sin!" part and act with less direct pressure on his ticket to Sinning. Changing him from outwardly distrustable to "I found out summoning wasn't my thing, but for the sake of Spira I yearn to become a Final Aeon!" would have created the veneer of piousness and goodness- with his death spiral obsession coming to light only later.

 

4 hours ago, Tamanoir said:

Including J2e's "translation" of FF4, and FF2.

I never heard of it until I discovered Legends of Localization, and wow it is awful. My pity for you. It appears to be the worst of a fan translation era that gave rise to all the FE translations from FE3-6 that were made and made most poorly. Kempf calling Olwen "bitch" anyone?

 

Since we're on the topic of Final Fantasy final battle themes. Let me just say I'm fine with Maybe I'm A Lion, but I loathe the phase of the final battle associated with it. Why? Because Braver just feels like a really forced and super shallow attempt at a psychological battle. 

 

3 hours ago, Armagon said:

Dawn of a New World (the two games that i hear get shit on but still has it's fans).

Dawn of the New World is considered a, I think the word is "Escort" title, as opposed to a "Mothership" mainline installment.

I could call it Tales of Symphonia Gaiden, in the sense the stakes are lower and the story not as grand. It throws around junk warm and fuzzy phrases a bit, and I'm not fond of the Emil-Marta romance (there are very few in gaming that I actually like). But lower your expectations, and things are certainly wayyyyy better than Chrono Trigger Gaiden- aka Chrono Cross.

Gameplay-wise, the big criticism is that all the return ToS main characters can't ever level except when the story autolevels them. Instead, you're encouraged to raise monsters, which isn't so appealing and not really deep or anything.

There are clear signs of a more limited budget too- no world map, shabby sidequests, and of the 8 Centurions, only 2 actually appear outside of non-sentient jewel form, which is just strange when the other two are so talkative.

It is nice that it provides some images of the Symphonia world after ToS, the combat is like ToA's but a bit more fluid, and the game does address at the end one little disconnect between Symphonia and Phantasia, the former a thousands of years prior prequel to the original Tales game (hence the two don't really share that much in common).

 

3 hours ago, Armagon said:

As for Dragon Quest, the "hook" for that series is that it still follows the original JRPG formula of creating your own party from the get-go. Not many JRPGs still do that, the only ones i can think of are Etrian Odyssey and 7th Dragon (specifically the third game, i don't know about the first two).

That depends on the game. DQIII is the first to use a class system with generic characters. DQIV basically takes all those III classes and turns each of them into one fixed character (well 2 in the case of Priests and Wizards). V has a fixed human cast that is basically classless with recruitable monsters. VI and VII have fixed characters, but you can freely assign and change their classes once you unlock the option a bit into the game. VIII gets rid of classes in favor of skill trees for your fixed characters. IX is back to III's system but massively modernized. X is an MMORPG. Not sure what XI is going to do.

If you want a create a your own characters game, try an Etrian Odyssey- ideally the EOIV demo on the eShop. Every 3DS EO has difficulty settings too if you think it is ever too hard.

 

1 hour ago, Armagon said:

Well, i've heard a lot of great things about 6 so i wouldn't blame you. Golden Sun is also another series i played. Well, only the second one (what was it called? Lost- something.) I actually do hope the Golden Sun series makes a comeback but i don't know how likely that is. Heard mixed things about Dark Dawn though.

It did nothing to fix any of the issues of the old games:

• Offensive Psynergy being junk outside of physical-based ones like Ragnarok and Heat Wave
• Unleashes being too your bread and butter offense otherwise
• The class system being unnecessary and really unexplained
• The characters being shallow 
• Summon rushing working
• The game being overly wordy for no good reason

In fact the game made some issues worse. Like featuring yet another Saturos-Menardi expy, who you get the sense are manipulating everything until the end- not fun. You have a final boss that is yet another fusion being, and the entire game begins and ends as a fetch quest, with a cliffhanger for a sequel that will never be made because this game is so wretched. The postgame superboss is just Dullahan again, with a 100% scripted battle AI and the cheap skill called Djinn Storm. Alex returns and escapes being fought yet again.

It also did silly things like make Matthew, Issac's son clone, respond only in four emoji faces to anything. Neither Issac nor Felix were ever really mute, they only appeared this way as the main characters- the "curse" goes away after The Broken Seal for Issac and in the ending of The Lost Age for Felix.

And it invented a beast people who are so kawaii and uncalled for- nobody asked for them. Two of the playable characters have like no reason to exist either. Did I mention points of no return with missable Djinn? And a RNG-based forging system with less options than The Lost Age's. 

 

1 hour ago, Armagon said:

I don't. Heard the name before but all that comes to mind is ARMS. Why, i don't know.

They're Sony exclusive line of RPGs (PS1 and PS2) with a Wild West theme to them. I've only played WA1 (of 5, with a remake of 1 in Alter Code F as well), which is pretty generic, but decent, and feels to be more of a SNES era product than a PS1 one. Gameplay is a little too conservative for my tastes, characters have only charm to fall back on with no real depth, and the story is generic. The battles are also hideous graphically- being in 3D that is so primitive they should have just aborted them for better looking 2D graphics.

I was going to try WA2, but the translation is meh apparently and not much better, besides also going a bit more sci-fi than the rest of the franchise. The PS2 has the rest of the games, I think they're decent, they tried a grid-based system later on, but perhaps not worth your time. You'll need to look more into yourself though.

Edited June 18, 2018 by Interdimensional Observer

[Slumber]

11 minutes ago, Tryhard said:

I suppose I can say that I find FF13 to be nowhere near as bad as people made it out to be.

People praised FFX for many years (I like it too), but it is just as linear as a game as FF13. They both follow a similar structure actually, opening up when you get to Gran Pulse and the Calm Lands respectively and yet that is one of the main complaints with FF13.

I'm not a huge fan of FFX, ESPECIALLY in regards to Spira, but it's not nearly as linear as FFXIII.

FFXIII has maybe... Two/three areas where you can go more than one path, outside of Gran Pulse? Which, while Gran Pulse is big and open, it's basically a monster gauntlet where you don't do anything of consequence aside from fight progressively stronger monsters. And those areas that aren't GP basically amount to being circle shaped or square shaped, and taking a different path doesn't amount to much.

FFX has plenty of these kinds of areas, the Mi'hen Highroad specifically has routes and areas you can only get to if you're riding a chocobo, there are optional areas, and areas that branch off into multiple different areas that you have to go back to later. Some hidden areas that you can only access with the airship. And the Calm Lands has honest to God sidequests to actually do beyond fighting progressively stronger monsters, which you can also do.

It's still markedly more linear than any of the FFs prior to X, but it's less linear than XIII, where they explicitly stated that they wanted to do a linear game because of Call of Duty.

Edited June 18, 2018 by Slumber

[Modamy]

6 minutes ago, Tryhard said:

I suppose I can say that I find FF13 to be nowhere near as bad as people made it out to be.

People praised FFX for many years (I like it too), but it is just as linear as a game as FF13. They both follow a similar structure actually, opening up when you get to Gran Pulse and the Calm Lands respectively and yet that is one of the main complaints with FF13.

My biggest problem with XIII is the soul crushing linearity but the battle system is pretty fun and I probably credit it the most for why I like class based battle systems. X was linear but there were distractions along the way to make it less of an on rails experience. Granted that really depends on whether or not you talk to npcs or had the patience to learn how to play blitzball. You also get an airship at some point so you can explore earlier areas and there are things to do there.

[Tryhard]

10 minutes ago, Slumber said:

I'm not a huge fan of FFX, ESPECIALLY in regards to Spira, but it's not nearly as linear as FFXIII.

FFXIII has maybe... Two/three areas where you can go more than one path, outside of Gran Pulse? And those areas basically amount to being circle shaped or square shaped, and taking a different path doesn't amount to much.

FFX has plenty of these kinds of areas, the Mi'hen Highroad specifically has routes and areas you can only get to if you're riding a chocobo, there are optional areas, and areas that branch off into multiple different areas that you have to go back to later. Some hidden areas that you can only access with the airship.

It's still markedly more linear than any of the FFs prior to X, but it's less linear than XIII, where they explicitly stated that they wanted to do a linear game because of Call of Duty.

I can see what you mean but it was still extremely linear, enough that I would call their level/map design comparable. Yet I've never heard a complaint about FFX's structure.

There are other problems: the cast in FF13 gets a resounding sigh from me, but it's not like FFX doesn't have Tidus or a few others either. The lack of towns is disappointing to a Final Fantasy game. The story is confusing (not that uncommon). I found the combat adequate and fun enough. (though I would prefer FFXs)

Really I only hold an average rating for the game but apparently this is above what most people have expressed on it.

 

Anyone played Treasure of the Rudras? It's a FF6-like game from Square where you make your own spells from prefixes and suffixes or just random words.

It was notorious for being difficult to translate because of those mechanics. Still, game is overlooked and is great. And the music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhOUDccL1i8

Edited June 18, 2018 by Tryhard

[DragonFlames]

7 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Dawn of the New World is considered a, I think the word is "Escort" title, as opposed to a "Mothership" mainline installment.

I could call it Tales of Symphonia Gaiden, in the sense the stakes are lower and the story not as grand. It throws around junk warm and fuzzy phrases a bit, and I'm not fond of the Emil-Marta romance (there are very few in gaming that I actually like). But lower your expectations, and things are certainly wayyyyy better than Chrono Trigger Gaiden- aka Chrono Cross.

Gameplay-wise, the big criticism is that all the return ToS main characters can't ever level except when the story autolevels them. Instead, you're encouraged to raise monsters, which isn't so appealing and not really deep or anything.

There are clear signs of a more limited budget too- no world map, shabby sidequests, and of the 8 Centurions, only 2 actually appear outside of non-sentient jewel form, which is just strange when the other two are so talkative.

It is nice that it provides some images of the Symphonia world after ToS, the combat is like ToA's but a bit more fluid, and the game does address at the end one little disconnect between Symphonia and Phantasia, the former a thousands of years prior prequel to the original Tales game (hence the two don't really share that much in common).

I guess this is my time to come out of the closet and say that Dawn of the New World was my introduction into the Tales franchise and even having played the original, this one still stands as one of my all-time favourite games. I liked the world, the characters, the story, the Marta-Emil romance was engaging enough for me to be rooting for them to get together (Marta is just a sweetheart in general and Emil was a nice change of pace from the generic heroic male lead, even if some people call him a "wuss") and the gameplay was fantastic. I played the Wii version first and bought the HD remaster - which came bundled with Symphonia - later and I really liked it both times. I'd even go so far as to say that it's better than the original Symphonia, especially in regards to gameplay.
Sure, in terms of story, Xillia, Xillia 2 and especially Berseria eventually beat it for my favourite Tales game, but I'm still really fond of it.

It was only later that I found out that it just might be the most hated game in the franchise and to this day, I'm asking "Why?"

[Slumber]

12 minutes ago, Tryhard said:

I can see what you mean but it was still extremely linear, enough that I would call their level/map design comparable. Yet I've never heard a complaint about FFX's structure.

There are other problems: the cast in FF13 gets a resounding sigh from me, but it's not like FFX doesn't have Tidus or a few others either. The lack of towns is disappointing to a Final Fantasy game. The story is confusing (not that uncommon).

Really I only hold an average rating for the game but apparently this is above what most people have expressed on it.

I'm curious if you played FFXIII more than once, because your stance sounds a lot like me when XIII was brand new and I had only played it once.

After my initial playthrough, I was largely in the same boat. I compared it favorably to X in most ways.

"Oh, X had a linear world, too. Oh, the characters were lame and boring, but at least they weren't Tidus, Yuna and Wakka. Oh, etc... This is a totally average game."

But I played it again, and after having the "experience" of seeing everything for the first time wear off, I started feeling how bad everything was compared to even X. And at the time, X was my least favorite game in the series. The linearity of the world really, really got to me, I hated everyone who wasn't Fang and Sazh(Especially Lightning, which hurt me to no end when shortly after this replay, Motomu Toriyama was like "Oh yeah, she's my waifu and I'm making a bunch of games about her, and I'm going to push her into every FF thing I can", and I realized I would be seeing Lightning in EVERYTHING for a good long while), the combat, which I wasn't too hot on the first time around, also started boring me to tears, and the realization I had about the story just angered me to no end. Even the OST started grating on me, as I started to feel that it was a pretty generic orchestral OST, lacking all of the charm previous FF OSTs have had.

I don't want this to devolve into an "FFXIII sucks" discussion, since that's just going to attract negativity and push people away(I have no hard feelings towards people who like XIII), but yeah. I just... can't go back to that game anymore.

Edited June 18, 2018 by Slumber

[Modamy]

No @Slumber Lightning's not his waifu she's his daughter

[Tryhard]

I played it twice, but it's been years now.

[Tamanoir]

16 minutes ago, Tryhard said:

I Anyone played Treasure of the Rudras? It's a FF6-like game from Square where you make your own spells from prefixes and suffixes or just random words.

It was notorious for being difficult to translate because of those mechanics. Still, game is overlooked and is great. And the music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhOUDccL1i8

I played through a good chunk of it, but enevr finished it. I should restart it at some point....

However I played Live a Live. This game was really great

[Slumber]

Just now, Modamy said:

No @Slumber Lightning's not his waifu she's his daughter

He says this...

But his comments about her when explaining her outfits for LR either mean he should NEVER have a daughter, or he's just lying to make it seem less creepy(When he actually made it more creepy).

[Tryhard]

If anything, the one I'll fight people over liking is FF8.

[DragonFlames]

Just now, Tryhard said:

If anything, the one I'll fight people over liking is FF8.

I dislike fighting over taste in general. I don't really see the point in that, to be honest.

I like FFXII the most, I enjoyed my time with XIII, X was my first and I still like playing it, although Blitzball is annoying, the minigame-festival that is X-2 is annoying, XIII-2 was okay, I didn't play Lightning Returns.
That's my overall opinion on the Final Fantasy games I've played.

[Slumber]

7 minutes ago, Tryhard said:

If anything, the one I'll fight people over liking is FF8.

I'll meet you in the Arby's parking lot.