Awakening is an amazing game

[Junkhead]

But then why rate a game based on how you feel about it instead of pseudo intellectual constructs. c:

[smgrinus]

@Oz ♠ I agree that the game was enjoyable with both old/new mechanics, and built to cater newcomers into the series. I did think the pairing of Gregor and Nowi was awkward even if she is actually a dragon and older. Some of the dialogues were somewhat cringy although not as bad as Fates. I truly liked what IS did with the overworld map, random encounters and battle sequences. 

[Junkhead]

12 minutes ago, grinus said:

@Oz ♠ I agree that the game was enjoyable with both old/new mechanics, and built to cater newcomers into the series. I did think the pairing of Gregor and Nowi was awkward even if she is actually a dragon and older. Some of the dialogues were somewhat cringy although not as bad as Fates. I truly liked what IS did with the overworld map, random encounters and battle sequences. 

The funny part is that I actually mean what I say, even as a quote unquote veteran player. The game had something new to offer, whether it was in it's sense of aesthetics, it's characters and the gameplay is just fun. I also praise it for it's replay value, unless you're one of those guys that grinds the fuck out of it and does it all in one run.

Nowi and everyone is awkward.

[Interdimensional Observer]

How dare you insult the criticisms of the learned! Without us, the world would be a sensuous unthinking mass of worthless nobody sheep who'd have never gotten past the Paleolithic stage of existence. (I jest.)

 

I played Awakening a lot when it came out, many runs, I can't remember how many exactly. I probably still have my males-only no kids run, which I grinded everyone to max stats on, gosh that was tedious. But after Fates and SoV, I can't see myself ever touching it again, Pair Up snowballs breaks things, but it also makes the game much more bearable due to the enemy phase mess it is. And I can't bring myself to remember the characters anymore- I just want to stay out of the fan turbulence that way.

[smgrinus]

Henry & Tharja were meant for each other.  :) 

[DragonFlames]

2 hours ago, Oz ♠ said:

But then why rate a game based on how you feel about it instead of pseudo intellectual constructs. c:

Psh, rating a game based on YOUR OWN opinion of it? What kind of universe are you living in?
No, you should and will ALWAYS follow the consensus! Even if every fiber of your being disagrees with it! Jeez, you've been living under one seriously big rock if you think YOUR opinion means anything when the consensus says otherwise!
Xander, Takumi and Azura are the best characters! Awakening is the worst Fire Emblem game! SoV's story was shit! If you think otherwise, you officially lose all existing privileges! And may whatever deity you believe in help you if your favourite characters or - dare I say - pairings don't perfectly align with the general consensus on who is the best and with whom they belong! Hooo boy, are you screwed if that's the case!

This was sarcasm / satire, for anyone who couldn't tell.

[eclipse]

But what if I well and truly think that Awakening was terrible?

. . .well, fine Awakening's story was terrible.  Gameplay was alright, even if the maps were a little boring.

[Nobody]

3 minutes ago, eclipse said:

But what if I well and truly think that Awakening was terrible?

Then you are right :D

[Interdimensional Observer]

1 minute ago, eclipse said:

But what if I well and truly think that Awakening was terrible?

. . .well, fine Awakening's story was terrible.  Gameplay was alright, even if the maps were a little boring.

Well if this is based on feeling and not just intellectual constructs, then I guess by the topic opening that is fine. Of course the issues arises of your feelings being influenced by your established intellectual constructs. FFtF is never bad for a little philosophical discussion. Nor is it for just Awakening to your inner Shadow Dragon of the Fateful Blazing Radiant Holy Three spirits.

[BrightBow]

1 hour ago, DragonFlames said:

Psh, rating a game based on YOUR OWN opinion of it? What kind of universe are you living in?
No, you should and will ALWAYS follow the consensus! Even if every fiber of your being disagrees with it! Jeez, you've been living under one seriously big rock if you think YOUR opinion means anything when the consensus says otherwise!
Xander, Takumi and Azura are the best characters! Awakening is the worst Fire Emblem game! SoV's story was shit! If you think otherwise, you officially lose all existing privileges! And may whatever deity you believe in help you if your favourite characters or - dare I say - pairings don't perfectly align with the general consensus on who is the best and with whom they belong! Hooo boy, are you screwed if that's the case!

This was sarcasm / satire, for anyone who couldn't tell.

To me that seems like a strange way to use sarcasm, seeing how that implies that one was some sort of rebel for disagreeing with any of these statements. Which is kinda silly given Awakening's obvious popularity. The rest of the statements also don't sound like anything that has any sort of consensus, as far as I can tell.

Edited June 15, 2018 by BrightBow

[Junkhead]

26 minutes ago, Nobody said:

Then you are right :D

you're just a hipster

32 minutes ago, eclipse said:

But what if I well and truly think that Awakening was terrible?

. . .well, fine Awakening's story was terrible.  Gameplay was alright, even if the maps were a little boring.

I legit never understand the complaints as to the story. It's just what it is. Traditional FE, basically. The only contraddictory thing is making an Avatar that's somewhat supposed to be a self-insert but proceeds to play it's own character and Mary Sue itself.

And the gameplay is just a lot more enjoyable when you avoid Pair Up, Tonics and grinding a ton.

[eclipse]

Just now, Oz ♠ said:

I legit never understand the complaints as to the story. It's just what it is. Traditional FE, basically. The only contraddictory thing is making an Avatar that's somewhat supposed to be a self-insert but proceeds to play it's own character and Mary Sue itself.

And the gameplay is just a lot more enjoyable when you avoid Pair Up, Tonics and grinding a ton.

It tried to do three different things at once.  Had it stuck to Gangrel's arc for the entire game, I would've been happier.

[Cysx]

It's firmly in the "guilty pleasure" camp for me. I can respect it.

I cannot, however, you know, respect it.

[Junkhead]

2 minutes ago, Cysx said:

It's firmly in the "guilty pleasure" camp for me. I can respect it.

I cannot, however, you know, respect it.

Why? Because people tell you it's supposed to be "bad"?

[Cysx]

2 minutes ago, Oz ♠ said:

Why? Because people tell you it's supposed to be "bad"?

I don't think so. I've played like, 300 hours of this game? More than enough to form my own opinion.

There are some things it did well, some very well even, and it's not a bad game at heart. There are also things I legitimately dislike about it, and even though it's one of my most played FE game, I don't think of it as one of my favorites.

[Junkhead]

3 minutes ago, Cysx said:

I don't think so. I've played like, 300 hours of this game? More than enough to form my own opinion.

There are some things it did well, some very well even, and it's not a bad game at heart. There are also things I legitimately dislike about it, and even though it's one of my most played FE game, I don't think of it as one of my favorites.

Well, then I guess you can't called so much a "guilty pleasure". I may not have even played half as much, and it's around 2nd or 3rd favourite FE. And even though it introduce new concepts that would ultimately get the series going (selling themselves to weaboo territory, sexualising chicks more often and making it known as a lame dating sim), it didn't seem like it got in the way of me enjoying it.

[BrightBow]

56 minutes ago, Oz ♠ said:

you're just a hipster

I legit never understand the complaints as to the story. It's just what it is. Traditional FE, basically. The only contraddictory thing is making an Avatar that's somewhat supposed to be a self-insert but proceeds to play it's own character and Mary Sue itself.

And the gameplay is just a lot more enjoyable when you avoid Pair Up, Tonics and grinding a ton.

I suppose the villains are very typical for a Fire Emblem game. The supposed heroes are a lot less so. They are utterly selfcentric at the best of days. Chrom overthrew Plegia and afterwards did absolutely nothing to stabilize the country, causing the land to descend into chaos and allowed the Grimleal to grab power and sacrifice it's population. Chrom later repeated the same thing with the entire continent of Valentia. Although unlike in the case with Plegia, the game never says what happened after it's ruler got defeated. Buuuuut the game was constantly repeating that the dynasts were only looking out for themselves, painting the picture of a country that is only held together by the power of Wallhart. So it's absurd to think that Wallhart's death wouldn't have caused a power vacuum that would throw the entire continent into a massive civil war. And it's even more absurd to think that Chrom would have done any precautions against this because we know for a fact that he did no such thing in Plegia.

Then of course Chrom alongside everyone else was utterly deadset against Robin sacrificing herself, without even as much as aknowledging his responsibility towards his people. And this is after Chrom was talking big to Wallhart about he would unite the entire world. Remember that one?:

Walhart: ME, JOIN YOU?! Does a pegasus join with the flea on its back? A dragon, with a cow it eats?! You forget your place, BOY. I am the Conqueror! I will unite the world!

Chrom: No! ...I will. And not by forcing all the people to choose the sword or the knee. Peace will only come by stoking people's hearts...not their fear.

But fuck that ambition and the responsibility that comes with it. Chrom is perfectly happy to let the entire world burn as long as it doesn't affect him and his friends personally. Just like your average tyrant he only cares about himself and his pals.

I most certainly could also write how poorly Robin and Lucina compare to previous protagonists but I suppose this post went on long enough as is.

Edited June 15, 2018 by BrightBow

[Cysx]

18 minutes ago, Oz ♠ said:

Well, then I guess you can't called so much a "guilty pleasure". I may not have even played half as much, and it's around 2nd or 3rd favourite FE. And even though it introduce new concepts that would ultimately get the series going (selling themselves to weaboo territory, sexualising chicks more often and making it known as a lame dating sim), it didn't seem like it got in the way of me enjoying it.

That's fair. In my case, it's just complicated really, that's ultimately the reason why I use that term even though it might not be 100% accurate. It's a game I don't really like that I somehow enjoy playing. I don't think much of its characters, but no way I'm letting any of them die on me. I think it's relatively poorly designed but dived deep into its mechanics, learned every formula, went out of my way to optimize every kid, bought apotheosis and struggled to beat it on my already completed lunatic playthrough with no other dlc... I greatly dislike the route they took with supports but still unlocked around 80% of them before I messed up and decided to stop...

Anyway, yeah, I don't think peer pressure has much of anything to do with it.

Edited June 15, 2018 by Cysx

[UNLEASH IT]

34 minutes ago, eclipse said:

But what if I well and truly think that Awakening was terrible?

. . .well, fine Awakening's story was terrible.  Gameplay was alright, even if the maps were a little boring.

It was the reverse for me. I found the story passable but I could not for the life of me get into those maps. It was like if Radiant dawn's part 4 was an entire game, with maps from Gaiden.

[Rose482]

I enjoyed the story, I remember being VERY VERY invested in the avatar past and what not, and really i feel like some  people are too harsh on Awakening, I see myself enjoy playing it more than some of the old games ( FE9 as an example)

[Slumber]

20 hours ago, Oz ♠ said:

I legit never understand the complaints as to the story. It's just what it is. Traditional FE, basically. The only contraddictory thing is making an Avatar that's somewhat supposed to be a self-insert but proceeds to play it's own character and Mary Sue itself.

And the gameplay is just a lot more enjoyable when you avoid Pair Up, Tonics and grinding a ton.

The story is a mess. I wouldn't say any of it is outright offensive like Fates' story can, but it has probably the sloppiest story out of any FE outside of Fates. 

Plegia arc: A passable, self-contained story in its own right. Gangrel falls under the category of being over-the-top cartoony villain that are basically a staple of the Fateswakening games, but he at least has somewhat of a connection to Chrom and Ylisse. Had the game just been this, it probably wouldn't get nearly the same amount of shit. 

Then things fall apart quickly. 

Valm arc: We're immediately introduced to a huge threat that nobody knew about that has already conquered one whole continent right next door. One of the VERY first things that happens is Chrom makes a deal with Validar, because he really needs the boats from that desert country. Without missing a beat, Validar immediately makes ominous and threatening comments without anybody really saying much else "Well we really need those boats.", and he brings out Grima!Robin to further taunt them and this plotline is left dangling until the end of the game with very little questioning. People make a big deal about Eirika trusting Fomortiis, and Celica trusting Jedeh, but everyone forgets THE WHOLE CAST OF THE GAME trusting Validar. Somebody more blatantly evil and untrustworthy than the goddamn devil, and somebody less convincing than a shady old man with blue skin. 

The arc as a whole feels very slapdash and filler-y, and if I am remembering correctly, the entire REASON for Walhart's campaign is something that isn't even hinted about until the Gaiden remake, which does (With arguable canonicity)confirm that a previous ruler of Valm at least encountered and knew about Grima. Prior to this, Walhart's sudden conquest is just him going "Agggghhh, something bad is going to happen to the world and I need to prepaaaaare", and everyone else just going "??? How the fuck could he possibly know that?"

And the answer to that is never given, and just like literally everything else in the Valm arc, it's suddenly forgotten because... 

Grimleal arc: We transition into some of the worst writing in the franchise. Everything is all because of the Grimleal, and everything happens because of Robin. They were all behind everything in the game and Robin is the reason. We're basically given a shitty recap of GotHW given in a few chapters, and it's really bad. That cackling, Jafar looking madman who kept making open threats? Whoops, turns out it was dumb to trust him and leave him relatively unopposed back home. The Grimleal as a whole? The most cartoonishly evil cult in the series. There's no reason to explain why they're the way they are, and literally everyone in Plegia who isn't actually part of the Grimleal hates them. 

And then that goddamn "Power of friendship" ending. If there's anything that encapsulates how worthless Chrom actually is in the grand scheme of the whole game, it's that. Chrom is so unwilling to let Robin, a random dude/dudette he met on the side of the road, die that he's about to doom future generations. 

Thankfully Robin can actually survive metaphysically killing him/herself because of friendship, or else Chrom would have looked like a real dick. 

It's a dumb, dumb, messy story. About 1/3(2/5 if I'm being generous) of it could be considered passable. Not amazing, just passable. The other 2/3 is borderline nonsense, and seemingly actively tries to retroactively ruin the 1/3 that's not painfully dull or dumb. 

I probably rambled a bit and let personal feelings get in the way... I probably got some details wrong, since it's been a bit since I played the game, and I don't ever intend on playing it ever again. I probably took a FFTF thread way too seriously. But it's a dumb, dumb story. The Plegia stuff is borderline, the rest is below borderline. Well below at points.

Edited June 16, 2018 by Slumber

[Pengaius]

Y'all are just crappin on awakening and making me feel bad about liking it.

well at least it was a good game to start the franchise on

I will never play Tellius

[Interdimensional Observer]

14 hours ago, BrightBow said:

I most certainly could also write how poorly Robin and Lucina compare to previous protagonists but I suppose this post went on long enough as is.

Care to explain your criticisms of her? Robin I get, I'm none too fond of them. But do touch on her.  

 

6 hours ago, Slumber said:

Plegia arc: A passable, self-contained story in its own right. Gangrel falls under the category of being over-the-top cartoony villain that are basically a staple of the Fateswakening games, but he at least has somewhat of a connection to Chrom and Ylisse. Had the game just been this, it probably wouldn't get nearly the same amount of shit. 

Then things fall apart quickly. 

Well Gangrel's title is Mad King- the same good old Ashnard. And PoR is basically a 1 vs. 1 + ally (Begnion) conflict, which Plegia vs. Ylisse + Regna Ferox would be. Well okay, Gallia and the Birds existed, but I think I still have a point here. PoR does get accused of being too basic, and it the Begnion Arc is sort of fillerish (until RD reveals it really wasn't, which unlike the SoV Grima stuff we can with certainty tell was in the works at the time of PoR), but overall I think it is, if boring, not bad either. 

Whilst I'm in complete agreement that the Grimleal Arc is awful, and Chrom is too stupidly emotional (although Squall does have a little something like that I criticize him over- fortunately the metaphysics of the moment leave it somewhat in question how much would be affected), I don't think it would be impossible to intermix an evil cult with Gangrel in one game. Walhart has to go entirely though, and the Grimleal needs a MASSIVE overhaul to work this way, I really really hate Validar.

The only saving grace Awakening gets, is that it was to be the series's swan song. But it doesn't keep it from being criticized, only offering an excuse to save it from being deemed the absolute worst.

 

And yeah, we're taking an FFtF topic too seriously.

[Nobody]

2 hours ago, Pengaius said:

Y'all are just crappin on awakening and making me feel bad about liking it.

There’s no need to feel bad about liking a bad game. Liking a bad game doesn’t make you a bad person, or any worse in any way.

[Infinite Dreams]

I loved Awakening.