About Byleth aka "the teacher"...!

[SuperSpaceWarrior]

On 7/9/2018 at 5:43 AM, Lau said:

My experience with silent protagonists is limited to Mark from Blazing Blade, Link, and the Pokemon protags, but honestly? I'd prefer a fully voiced Byleth in the same way Kris, Robin and Corrin were. I'm sorry, but I feel like having a silent avatar just makes them...pointless?  Especially if they're going to be playable.

Representing the player is exactly the point of an Avatar in the first place. If the character has a distinct personality, then can you really still call it an avatar? I know in your post you said you'd rather just have a fleshed out character than an avatar of any kind, and I agree that that would be great, though I do also like player avatars. The problem is if IS tries to go halfway between avatar and full character, so you get a character who is intended to represent the player, but just doesn't.

[Lau]

1 hour ago, SuperSpaceWarrior said:

Representing the player is exactly the point of an Avatar in the first place. If the character has a distinct personality, then can you really still call it an avatar? I know in your post you said you'd rather just have a fleshed out character than an avatar of any kind, and I agree that that would be great, though I do also like player avatars. The problem is if IS tries to go halfway between avatar and full character, so you get a character who is intended to represent the player, but just doesn't.

Oh, I completely agree. My problem is really with the way IS has been doing the entire avatar concept. Robin and Corrin have their own distinct personalities, I even consider them actual characters, rather than avatars. I think if IS truly wants an avatar to represent the player, they should add dialogue options. They don't have to be options that affect the story or whatever, they could just be based on personality traits - cheerful, naïve, timid, etc. 

A silent avatar just makes it even harder to represent the player. How would you even make the avatar interesting if they don't speak up? I personally find it hard to connect to someone who never speaks up. It ruins the immersion too, as you have the cast asking you something, and then repeating what you "said". It's why I can't take Kiran from FEH seriously as an avatar. 

I know that some people may point towards Link from LoZ, but is he really an avatar? You can't choose his gender, and in many games, you can't even change his name.

A personal favourite avatar of mine, if it's worth anything, is the Hero from the Pokemon Mystery Dungeon games. There are many instances where you can choose your dialogue - leading to occasions where you can troll your partner.

[Sentinel07]

On 7/5/2018 at 9:36 PM, Flee Fleet! said:

I guess that's a possibility. Or Byleth's just super serious/emotionless.

I think having a silent avatar (with decisions to make choices) is better than having an avatar with an already established personality.

 

 

I very much agree. I probably would have liked Corrin a little more if he'd just kept his whiny mouth shut.

[Three Eyes]

I always considered Corrin and Robin player characters, but not necessarily avatars.  Player characters in the sense that I experienced the events of game through them, could project onto them and better relate to the story and make it feel more personal, but not avatars in the sense that I ever considered them extensions of myself.

And personally, I prefer this to silent avatars because that always feels stilted and unnatural to me in dialogue-heavy games.  It works with Link because he doesn't have to interact with people very often, but honestly, Link doesn't even feel like an avatar anymore himself.

I hope that Byleth is like Robin/Corrin in the sense that he has his own personality, just because it's generally more entertaining that way.  I don't need it to be me.  I'm hoping for his personality to be different than both of theirs too, probably a more grim and serious Robin.

[MyBoyHector]

I'm happy for the avatar to be voiced, be able to make choices and have an opinion, just don't make the avatar the main character or take away from the main character, Robin for that reason was cringe, and Robin, while I liked, I was annoyed because he/she steals a lot of spotlight from Chrom, especially during the "Dark Family Reunion" part.

[Quiyonce]

kgrgAs for the trailer, I'm not sure how game developing works but I feel like if Byleth really is an avatar/mu then it'd be easier to finish all the different player builds before adding in the dialogue/animations. I think there's a possibility that there will be a silent protag option but unless are completely gutted, I highly doubt it will be the only option.

 

On 7/6/2018 at 3:05 AM, NekoKnight said:

I think silent protagonists are fine when you don't really need to interact with anyone on a serious level. It works in Pokemon or Dark Souls (I wonder how often those are compared) because the games are just running around and listening to monologues when need be. For a series like Fire Emblem where character interaction is a big thing, it just feels weird to have this guy standing there who at best gives implied answers. It doesn't make the world more immersive to me, it just feels like the "protagonist" got their personality gutted.

I don't want to see a return of Mark from Blazing Sword. Another Robin who plays a supporting role to Adelgard would be the best, in my opinion.

Yeah, I can't completely see Fire Emblem working with a silent protag

On 7/7/2018 at 12:08 PM, Flee Fleet! said:

Furthermore IS didn't really handle any of the avatars we had so far in a really good way (though I'm unsure about Corrin and Robin since I didn't play Awakening or Fates, but based on what most others said, they don't seem to be very liked due to the way they were handled...).

I don't think Robin and Corrin were perfect but I think this site in particular isn't a reasonable place to base your opinions on how well-liked the two are. Serenes Forest opinions on things seem to differ from a lot of fans outside of the website (at least from the people I know irl).

On 7/11/2018 at 4:01 PM, Lau said:

Oh, I completely agree. My problem is really with the way IS has been doing the entire avatar concept. Robin and Corrin have their own distinct personalities, I even consider them actual characters, rather than avatars. I think if IS truly wants an avatar to represent the player, they should add dialogue options. They don't have to be options that affect the story or whatever, they could just be based on personality traits - cheerful, naïve, timid, etc. 

A silent avatar just makes it even harder to represent the player. How would you even make the avatar interesting if they don't speak up? I personally find it hard to connect to someone who never speaks up. It ruins the immersion too, as you have the cast asking you something, and then repeating what you "said". 

A personal favourite avatar of mine, if it's worth anything, is the Hero from the Pokemon Mystery Dungeon games. There are many instances where you can choose your dialogue - leading to occasions where you can troll your partner.

I agree with a lot of this. I think IntSys could take a lot of aspects from PMD to improve their player characters. I like Robin and Awakening but I think that PMD does a better job of the 'amnesiac that's connected to the end of the world' story. However, I think it's worth noting that you are the center of the plot in those games instead of sharing the spotlight or being a supporter like Kris or Robin. I think it's harder to write multiple personalities for a supporting role when that character isn't the one that the main plot is following.

Also, I think there needs to be a more clear distinction between what an avatar is in contrast to a player character. I think expecting IntSys to give us DND/MMORPG immersion from a player character is a tad unfair. I think the past units were more meant to be a lens for us to view the events of a game rather than a complete mirror of ourselves that we play as.

On 7/11/2018 at 9:24 PM, MyBoyHector said:

I'm happy for the avatar to be voiced, be able to make choices and have an opinion, just don't make the avatar the main character or take away from the main character, Robin for that reason was cringe, and Robin, while I liked, I was annoyed because he/she steals a lot of spotlight from Chrom, especially during the "Dark Family Reunion" part.

Personally, I think of Chrom and Robin as a duo of lords. I don't see Robin as taking anything away from Chrom so much as them complimenting each other well and sharing the spotlight.

Edited July 25, 2018 by Quiyonce

[NekoKnight]

2 hours ago, Quiyonce said:

Personally, I think of Chrom and Robin as a duo of lords. I don't see Robin as taking anything away from Chrom so much as them complimenting each other well and sharing the spotlight.

I never understood the criticism of Robin "stealing the spotlight" as if being an Avatar condemns you to a minor support role. The first scene shows both Robin and Chrom fighting together and then the actual game starts with them finding Robin in a field. They've  always been side by side. At worst, they have different acts where they gain more prominence than the other.

[Chopper...]

On 25/07/2018 at 10:02 PM, NekoKnight said:

I never understood the criticism of Robin "stealing the spotlight" as if being an Avatar condemns you to a minor support role. The first scene shows both Robin and Chrom fighting together and then the actual game starts with them finding Robin in a field. They've  always been side by side. At worst, they have different acts where they gain more prominence than the other.

That's because many people think about the avatar as an intruder to the story, which is an opinion I don't share nor understand, but can respect.

Edited August 4, 2018 by Chopper...