Rapha666br

Reinforcements with no warning?

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OK, my first time playing fates. I'm on conquest hard mode on chapter 13. I aproach the boss to bait and kill, then a bunch cavalier appear right in range of my units while the boss was still alive with the wivern riders by his side. I don't have enough units to be able to one turn ko all of the and some units were left defenceless truing to ko them (thank you 80% hit rates) and dying. I just played awakining for my first time on nomral, and while it was a bit too easy( thankfuly fates is a lot more balanced), it felt fair as the games warn you of reinforcements. In Fates? No clue of, not even forts in that chapter. Big step back in my opnion. Or am my missing something for skipping normal mode?

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They might give you a hamfisted warning in Awakening, but the enemies also move has soon as they spawn, before you can grasp any idea as to where they're coming from, what unit types they are and how powerful they are. That's way worse than surprise reinforcements after crossing a certain boundary imo. They give you warning, but no actual way to prepare.

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Just be glad they cant attack the turn they show up, which was something that happens on hard and up in Awakening. 

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You're literally the first person I've seen who has said that reinforcements is handled more fairly in Awakening than in Fates.

I do think it's fair for reinforcements to spawn in at certain boundary points.  It encourages you to not just rush the boss with reckless abandon.  But Awakening's reinforcement rules are so often a load of crap.  There are times when you know ahead of time that enemies are coming, but don't forget that there are plenty of times where you don't get any warning whatsoever.  And enemies being able to attack you as soon as they spawn just sucks.  It feels like you're getting punished for no good reason.  It also hurts replayability because the surprises no longer affect you on account of you knowing well ahead of time that enemy reinforcements are coming.  While in Fates, the surprise isn't such a huge factor because they usually give you a turn to react to the spawning reinforcements.

That being said, Revelation Chapters 7 and 10 are a bunch of hot garbage.  It's like Awakening's unfair reinforcement BS and Thracia's awful fog of war had twin mutant babies, one of which came out of the womb covered in ice chunks for no apparent reason.

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If you REALLY want to whine about reinforcements, go play Sword of Seals, where they spawned before enemy phase. What you're complaining about is peanuts in comparison.

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7 minutes ago, Ertrick36 said:

You're literally the first person I've seen who has said that reinforcements is handled more fairly in Awakening than in Fates.

I do think it's fair for reinforcements to spawn in at certain boundary points.  It encourages you to not just rush the boss with reckless abandon.  But Awakening's reinforcement rules are so often a load of crap.  There are times when you know ahead of time that enemies are coming, but don't forget that there are plenty of times where you don't get any warning whatsoever.  And enemies being able to attack you as soon as they spawn just sucks.  It feels like you're getting punished for no good reason.  It also hurts replayability because the surprises no longer affect you on account of you knowing well ahead of time that enemy reinforcements are coming.  While in Fates, the surprise isn't such a huge factor because they usually give you a turn to react to the spawning reinforcements.

That being said, Revelation Chapters 7 and 10 are a bunch of hot garbage.  It's like Awakening's unfair reinforcement BS and Thracia's awful fog of war had twin mutant babies, one of which came out of the womb covered in ice chunks for no apparent reason.

I have played thracia just before awekining, and yup, that games is cheap. not dificult, the enemeis are weak, but the little surprises just make you restart the chapter. And yes, I was well aware of Awekining's reinforcements on hard, I was on a blind run with no guides and decided to play on normal for that reason. Turns out being the easiest FE I have ever played with broken pair up and reclassing. And I didn't do a single skirmish, I was actualy trying not to ovelrlevel my characters by using others during side chapters. For that reason I picked fates directly on hard( I always play on normal first), and god, that game is GOOD and actualy balanced, and I am getting my ass kicked for not checking enemy skills, but I am learning. My only complain is the lack of warnings, the enemies are silent, kinda miss that from awekining.

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57 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

If you REALLY want to whine about reinforcements, go play Sword of Seals, where they spawned before enemy phase. What you're complaining about is peanuts in comparison.

I am well aware of that, Iplayed every FE with the exeption of the NES and 3ds games. That is a old game, those games didn't age so well for a reason.  Fates is a new game, and after the improvement they did in awekining, I expected nothing less.

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1 hour ago, Rapha666br said:

I am well aware of that, Iplayed every FE with the exeption of the NES and 3ds games. That is a old game, those games didn't age so well for a reason.  Fates is a new game, and after the improvement they did in awekining, I expected nothing less.

Yeah, well, what about the fact that Path of Radiance pulls the same crap, except with an absurdly overpowered unit that WILL kill a unit if he gets to them? And unlike what you're whining about, you don't get a turn to either brace for impact or strike before they can cause trouble; you just lose someone unless you happened to get tipped off that the Black Knight (the unit in question) would pop out of a house right near your starting point after engaging the boss.

Edited by Shadow Mir

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2 hours ago, Shadow Mir said:

If you REALLY want to whine about reinforcements, go play Sword of Seals, where they spawned before enemy phase. What you're complaining about is peanuts in comparison.

personally think that FE6 handles ambush enemies quite well, but yeah, it was admittedly a bit of a turn-off at first. also new mystery does that as well if i remember correctly (probably a topic for a later rant lol)

now what i actually wanted to say.

6 hours ago, Rapha666br said:

OK, my first time playing fates. I'm on conquest hard mode on chapter 13. I aproach the boss to bait and kill, then a bunch cavalier appear right in range of my units while the boss was still alive with the wivern riders by his side. I don't have enough units to be able to one turn ko all of the and some units were left defenceless truing to ko them (thank you 80% hit rates) and dying. I just played awakining for my first time on nomral, and while it was a bit too easy( thankfuly fates is a lot more balanced), it felt fair as the games warn you of reinforcements. In Fates? No clue of, not even forts in that chapter. Big step back in my opnion. Or am my missing something for skipping normal mode?

 awakening normal to conquest hard is a huge difficulty spike. neither game is particularly challenging (especially awakening-N)  to an FE veteran, but i can say in hindsight that even conquest normal felt insane compared to awakening normal. honestly, you should not have played hard mode first. most FE feels unfair blind tbh, so go at hard mode on a second run. and generally, there is always a way to avoid death by abusing pair up and just fucking off back a couple o' tiles.

id like to ask, how aggro do you play in FE? because FE is not a game series meant to be played pure aggro ('cept awakening-N but whatever), especially when your playing a game as actually hard as conquest. so be totally honest if you respond, and if you dont, it doesn't matter, this is really just advice, in case you do play too aggro due to awakening habits.

also, by description of your situation, it sounds like you could just have killed Scarlet with niles, assuming you brought him, of course, and cleaned up and pushed in to stay safe, and you would have been fine. honestly, you could totally play differently the next run of the chapter, armed with new knowledge, because, though not explicitly stated, most people would only complain about mechanics if a unit died to them, and as we all know, if a unit dies, you reset (with L+R+Start. i only discovered that trick after i was explicitly told by a friend so sorry if you knew that already)

anyway, sorry for going on this long ass wall of text, just wanted to say my stuff. 

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43 minutes ago, (s)ad touch said:

personally think that FE6 handles ambush enemies quite well, but yeah, it was admittedly a bit of a turn-off at first. also new mystery does that as well if i remember correctly (probably a topic for a later rant lol)

Honestly, I think it's fake difficulty. And FE6 is already one of the most frustrating games in existence. It being reinforcement happy only serves to make things worse.

43 minutes ago, (s)ad touch said:

also, by description of your situation, it sounds like you could just have killed Scarlet with niles, assuming you brought him, of course, and cleaned up and pushed in to stay safe, and you would have been fine.

Niles probably wouldn't have very good hit rates since Scarlet has Bowbreaker...

Edited by Shadow Mir

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5 hours ago, (s)ad touch said:

personally think that FE6 handles ambush enemies quite well, but yeah, it was admittedly a bit of a turn-off at first. also new mystery does that as well if i remember correctly (probably a topic for a later rant lol)

now what i actually wanted to say.

 awakening normal to conquest hard is a huge difficulty spike. neither game is particularly challenging (especially awakening-N)  to an FE veteran, but i can say in hindsight that even conquest normal felt insane compared to awakening normal. honestly, you should not have played hard mode first. most FE feels unfair blind tbh, so go at hard mode on a second run. and generally, there is always a way to avoid death by abusing pair up and just fucking off back a couple o' tiles.

id like to ask, how aggro do you play in FE? because FE is not a game series meant to be played pure aggro ('cept awakening-N but whatever), especially when your playing a game as actually hard as conquest. so be totally honest if you respond, and if you dont, it doesn't matter, this is really just advice, in case you do play too aggro due to awakening habits.

also, by description of your situation, it sounds like you could just have killed Scarlet with niles, assuming you brought him, of course, and cleaned up and pushed in to stay safe, and you would have been fine. honestly, you could totally play differently the next run of the chapter, armed with new knowledge, because, though not explicitly stated, most people would only complain about mechanics if a unit died to them, and as we all know, if a unit dies, you reset (with L+R+Start. i only discovered that trick after i was explicitly told by a friend so sorry if you knew that already)

anyway, sorry for going on this long ass wall of text, just wanted to say my stuff. 

OH wow. There's a soft reset in this game!? Here I was looking like a fool by using suspend to return to the main menu.

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9 hours ago, Rapha666br said:

[...] I picked fates directly on hard( I always play on normal first), and god, that game is GOOD and actualy balanced, and I am getting my ass kicked for not checking enemy skills, but I am learning.


Only Conquest, actually. Birthright is as broken/ boring as Awakening.
In my opinion, choosing Hard Classic was the right decision, specially for a veteran. It can be though, but in a fun way.

Remember to always check enemy skills and their inventory, and to (ab)use the bonuses given by your adjacent/ pair units.
Have fun, cara.

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12 hours ago, (s)ad touch said:

personally think that FE6 handles ambush enemies quite well, but yeah, it was admittedly a bit of a turn-off at first. also new mystery does that as well if i remember correctly (probably a topic for a later rant lol)

now what i actually wanted to say.

 awakening normal to conquest hard is a huge difficulty spike. neither game is particularly challenging (especially awakening-N)  to an FE veteran, but i can say in hindsight that even conquest normal felt insane compared to awakening normal. honestly, you should not have played hard mode first. most FE feels unfair blind tbh, so go at hard mode on a second run. and generally, there is always a way to avoid death by abusing pair up and just fucking off back a couple o' tiles.

id like to ask, how aggro do you play in FE? because FE is not a game series meant to be played pure aggro ('cept awakening-N but whatever), especially when your playing a game as actually hard as conquest. so be totally honest if you respond, and if you dont, it doesn't matter, this is really just advice, in case you do play too aggro due to awakening habits.

also, by description of your situation, it sounds like you could just have killed Scarlet with niles, assuming you brought him, of course, and cleaned up and pushed in to stay safe, and you would have been fine. honestly, you could totally play differently the next run of the chapter, armed with new knowledge, because, though not explicitly stated, most people would only complain about mechanics if a unit died to them, and as we all know, if a unit dies, you reset (with L+R+Start. i only discovered that trick after i was explicitly told by a friend so sorry if you knew that already)

anyway, sorry for going on this long ass wall of text, just wanted to say my stuff. 

I did replay the chapter and completed it on mt first retry after that, so strategy was everthing. I approached through the west instead, so the reinforcements couldn't reach me in the same turn I face the boss. And no, I don't  play thinking of aggro. I tried killing all of them, but an atack was missed and 2 cavaliers were left. And since this game 2 enemies are basicaly 4, it can get damgerous quickly. Kana died( was not paired up). So it was more or less my fault for taking the risk. I'm completing chapters with as few turns as possible and not farming anything to avoid the overleveleving problem I had in Awekining. Though I AM exagerating a bit here. I just wanted to point my critical, I am not really salty or anything ( although I did get when I had to restart the chapter lol). I am loving the game) , it's just a nitpick here really.

Edited by Rapha666br

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5 hours ago, starburst said:


Only Conquest, actually. Birthright is as broken/ boring as Awakening.
In my opinion, choosing Hard Classic was the right decision, specially for a veteran. It can be though, but in a fun way.

Remember to always check enemy skills and their inventory, and to (ab)use the bonuses given by your adjacent/ pair units.
Have fun, cara.

Yes, i know Birthright can be farmable as awakining, but that can be avoided if you want. I did not do a single skirmish in Awekining. The pair up mechanic in fates is a lot more balanced, I do not expect Birtgright to be as broken as awekining. Either way I will be playing on hard. It also seams like fates punishes you for using overleved units by giving a lot less exp than Awekining, so that probably will not be a concern for me this time. 

Hard was a bit too much for a first blind run, I restarted ch 10( the one were you have to defend) way too many times, but it is doable with the roght strategy. Still easier than Thracia 776 wich I abused save states lol. I always do normal first, this is my first time starting on hard before normal, and I blame Awekining for that LOL.

Edited by Rapha666br

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7 hours ago, Rapha666br said:

Hard was a bit too much for a first blind run, I restarted ch 10( the one were you have to defend) way too many times, but it is doable with the roght strategy. Still easier than Thracia 776 wich I abused save states lol. I always do normal first, this is my first time starting on hard before normal, and I blame Awekining for that LOL.

 

The thing is that the enemy skills are completely different on Conquest Normal than on Hard. I think that replaying a map on Hard ‘feels fairer’ than playing it on Normal once and then on Hard.

I have played this game a dozen times on Hard, and I still play numerous maps twice, to test units/ classes that I had never used and set up the best route with the current party.

That would actually be my general advice for Conquest: play the map once to know it, then replay it for real. It makes you less salty.

Oh!, and Lunatic is a different beast; an interesting challenge no matter how many times you have beaten the game on Hard. (I have never played Awakening Lunatic or Lunatic+, but everyone says that those difficulties are simply luck-reliant bullshit, while Conquest Lunatic is an actual new doable challenge.)

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Off topic, but I'm thinking about dumping silas for his daughter Sophie (Elfie is the mother). Her skills look better, but stats are overall the same, but less supports, I don't know what to do :(

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On 5/8/2018 at 5:16 PM, Rapha666br said:

Off topic, but I'm thinking about dumping silas for his daughter Sophie (Elfie is the mother). Her skills look better, but stats are overall the same, but less supports, I don't know what to do

But Sophie’s class tree is the same as Silas’s: Cavalier and Mercenary. And with Effie as her mother, she only gets access to Knight, which is not versatile.

In this set up, Sophie will be better than her father on every statistic bar Defence (and she might have a little less Skill, still not as bad as her mother’s.)

When you mention supports, is it because of the re-classing options or bonuses? If the former, Silas’s most useful support comes from Kaze. While Sophie does not need re-classing. Her best friend is most likely Velouria, who gives her Berserker, but Sophie wants a class that grants her better Defence growths and lets her keep the Lance rank.

If you are thinking on the pair-up bonuses, you will simply learn to rely on what is available. I mean, A- and S- Support bonuses are great, but adults will always have more support options (and thus better pair-up bonuses) than children. And kids like Ophelia or Velouria are still overpowered despite only being able to support with two or three party members. 

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12 hours ago, starburst said:

But Sophie’s class tree is the same as Silas’s: Cavalier and Mercenary. And with Effie as her mother, she only gets access to Knight, which is not versatile.

In this set up, Sophie will be better than her father on every statistic bar Defence (and she might have a little less Skill, still not as bad as her mother’s.)

When you mention supports, is it because of the re-classing options or bonuses? If the former, Silas’s most useful support comes from Kaze. While Sophie does not need re-classing. Her best friend is most likely Velouria, who gives her Berserker, but Sophie wants a class that grants her better Defence growths and lets her keep the Lance rank.

If you are thinking on the pair-up bonuses, you will simply learn to rely on what is available. I mean, A- and S- Support bonuses are great, but adults will always have more support options (and thus better pair-up bonuses) than children. And kids like Ophelia or Velouria are still overpowered despite only being able to support with two or three party members. 

I do not like reclassing, I keep characters as they are and just promote them( I am always like this). It's for the bonuses, wich honestly isn't a big thing in this game compared to Awekining. I ended up dumping both, they just couldn't catch up with the royals. CH 22's reifnorcements were ridiculous( and again, no warining), I had to restart many times and rethink my strategy. My army is missing units now, 2 or 3. I'm on paralogue 16 now for forrest( Nyx is the mother, yay magic growth), he will take one of the spots, Xander's son (with Azura) will take other. Loving the child system in this game, they are recruited with their level based on the chapter you are, that's awesome if you have been lacking good units. Trying Nilas and Elise now, but they are still on C support... Selena can already marry Arthur but I am not sure. Out of the royals, only Selena , Elfie( most reliable unit in the game lol) and Nilas(damn he is a killing machine with that speed) are properly leveled. The others will be dumped and are only being used for supporting and making childs. The royals are just too easy to use and too good to not be used. Not only they come with good levels and stats, they also come with their own strong weapons and can use dragon veins, wich is crucial for later chapters. Playing hard for the first time, there is no reason to not use them. It kinda reminds of the royal laguz from Radiant Dawn.

Edited by Rapha666br

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