I feel cheated :(

[SMEDIA]

Now I’m not saying I didn’t enjoy playing this game for the first time with as little knowledge of what’s coming up ahead in the game, it’s just that since I obviously didn’t get the true ending, I don’t feel like I completed the game.

You see, I believe that with FE, the programers intended for the player to NEVER use save abuse of any kind. I don’t mean you’re supposed to beat the game in one sitting, it’s just that if someone dies (excluding the Lord of course) or you missed getting a useful item, you’re supposed to continue on until you beat the game or your Lord dies. If your lord dies, THEN go ahead and restart from your last save.

So anyway, I played on normal mode like this and beat Zephiel, but because I only played one Gaiden chapter, I didn’t get the true ending. Why would the programmers make the way to get the true ending contradictory to the way I played the game (which is what I believe is the intended way to play the game)?

Anyway, I of course intend to try to get the true ending, but I have a couple questions:

How does the route split between 10A,11A and 10B/11B work? I visited both villages and got 10B/11B.

I’m not sure if I’m confusing him with Hugh, but is Lugh useful? I gave him 4 level ups and his magic stat didn’t increase once, so I benched him. Similarly, I gave Sue about 4 level ups and her strength didn’t increase once.

Is Noah the absolute worst of the caveliers? I used him but he got killed. At the time of his death, he was last in every stat behind the other three.

If I risk talking to Gale in Chapter 21 with Miledy or Zeis, do I get anything? I couldn’t do it on my play through cause Miledy unfortunately died before I could recruit Zeis.

[Slumber]

I don't see many people who enjoy the way Binding handled its "true ending" and Gaiden chapters. I think the intention is that you're supposed to play the game as fast and as efficiently as is reasonably expected, but the game doesn't tell you that you need to do this to get the true ending, so people don't know that losing a random unit, not beating a chapter fast enough, or killing specific hostile units will completely block them from reaching it.

People tell me Lugh's useful, but he's always been bad in my runs. I generally wait until Hugh and just pay out the ass for a relatively RNG-safe Mage, though I'm probably an anomaly in that regard. Sue's strength kinda sucks, so it's not crazy to get 4 levels and no strength.

Noah is indeed the worst Cavalier. You can send him to his death after recruiting Fir.

I don't think Gale gives you anything. I think it's just meant to be closure for his character if you talk to him with Zeis or Miledy.

Edited October 5, 2018 by Slumber

[Interdimensional Observer]

39 minutes ago, SMEDIA said:

You see, I believe that with FE, the programers intended for the player to NEVER use save abuse of any kind. I don’t mean you’re supposed to beat the game in one sitting, it’s just that if someone dies (excluding the Lord of course) or you missed getting a useful item, you’re supposed to continue on until you beat the game or your Lord dies. If your lord dies, THEN go ahead and restart from your last save.

That was true of FE1. They abandoned this somewhere later along the line. When? Not FE5, certainly by FE7. Although FE4 and Gaiden seem to have also been out of tune with this idea. FE6 might have kept to it, even while adding Supports, but it might not have.

 

39 minutes ago, SMEDIA said:

So anyway, I played on normal mode like this and beat Zephiel, but because I only played one Gaiden chapter, I didn’t get the true ending. Why would the programmers make the way to get the true ending contradictory to the way I played the game (which is what I believe is the intended way to play the game)?

 

The two endings- normal and true, is directly inspired by FE3 Book 2. Get all the Starsphere fragments and the other missable Gemstones, and you get the true ending, otherwise you don't. FE6 of course was a return to Archanean simplicity, and also filled with remixed plot and character ideas from Archanea.

The choice to force you to keep certain characters alive was not in FE3 B2 however. The point was to integrate more characters into the plot a little, since the characters you have to keep alive are connected in some way to the Divine Weapon they lead you to. In writing however, this was so thinly integrated SIn, Douglas, and Melady make two quick opening remarks each, nobody does for Ilia, that it really shouldn't have been done.

 

39 minutes ago, SMEDIA said:

I’m not sure if I’m confusing him with Hugh, but is Lugh useful? I gave him 4 level ups and his magic stat didn’t increase once, so I benched him. Similarly, I gave Sue about 4 level ups and her strength didn’t increase once.

Take what I'm about to say with a few shakes of salt, going purely on averages and what i hear about the game. I'm just trying to help.

Lugh the green-haired Mage? Well he joins the earliest, and is fast and accurate, unlike Lilina (his Spd and Skl are 50% & 50% to her 35% & 20%). His lower Mag growth (40% to Lilina's 75%) is his weakness though, and him being screwed in it is the most common thing to happen if he goes awry from his averages. Still, as long as he gains Spd and isn't absolutely Mag screwed, being able to target Res guarantees a decent source of damage.

Sue has only a 30% Str growth, but she is fast with a 65% growth. Being more mobile and having an easier time doubling likely compensates for Wolt and Dorothy's higher Str and durability. Sin is just slightly slower than Sue, but still fast and is stronger to boot. Bows are decent in FE6 due to plenty of Wyvern Riders.

 

39 minutes ago, SMEDIA said:

Is Noah the absolute worst of the caveliers? I used him but he got killed. At the time of his death, he was last in every stat behind the other three.

 

Looking at 20/10 averages, you'd probably be right. Trec has a significant Str lead on Noah, and loses notably only in Skl. Alen is stronger, faster, and has no significant losses to Noah. Lance is still stronger than Noah, but less than the other two, and faster with no significant losses again. Noah does have 1 more Con, but that is nothing really. He has the highest base level and C Sword rank compared to Es elsewhere too, but those are minor advantages.

 

39 minutes ago, SMEDIA said:

If I risk talking to Gale in Chapter 21 with Miledy or Zeis, do I get anything? I couldn’t do it on my play through cause Miledy unfortunately died before I could recruit Zeis.

I do not believe so.

Edited October 5, 2018 by Interdimensional Observer

[DarthR0xas]

42 minutes ago, SMEDIA said:

If I risk talking to Gale in Chapter 21 with Miledy or Zeis, do I get anything? I couldn’t do it on my play through cause Miledy unfortunately died before I could recruit Zeis.

Nope, nothing of importance. What was originally intended was for him to be recruited, but that fell through last minute.

[Slumber]

11 minutes ago, DarthR0xas said:

Nope, nothing of importance. What was originally intended was for him to be recruited, but that fell through last minute.

Brutal.

"What do we do about Gale's recruitment?"

"No time. Kill him."

[Ertrick36]

I mean... in every iteration of Shadow Dragon's story, you get locked out of the ideal ending if Caeda dies, and in the second part of the Archanea story (Book 2 of Mystery and New Mystery) you could miss out on the most ideal endings if either A) you don't bring a certain four to endgame (mostly just to save a few prominent characters' lives) and B) if you don't obtain every orb in the game.

So what I'm saying is that FE has not always been designed for you to be able to get the ideal ending by blazing through without saving everyone and everything.

That being said, Binding Blade's Gaiden requirements can be pretty stupid sometimes.  Or they're unexplained.  Mystery Book 2 at least makes it abundantly clear that you're supposed to be gathering the star shards and the orbs, but Binding Blade doesn't tell you that you need to beat certain chapters within a particular number of turns and keep certain characters alive in order to obtain their gaiden chapters.  It only ever gives you subtle hints that you'd only really catch if you actually knew the requirements/chapter placement in the first place (e.g. scenes after an excessive number of turns [25 or so] indicate you've taken too long, any high-ranking/important individuals should be kept alive until the end of their recruitment chapter, etc.).

I think part of the reasoning for this was to reward good players, and another part was to force replayability out of more casual players.  Obviously this was a poor decision that was never again repeated, they instead encouraging the replayability through supports, difficulty settings, and Hector mode in Blazing Blade, and having the rewards for mastering the game be more intrinsic in value.

38 minutes ago, SMEDIA said:

I’m not sure if I’m confusing him with Hugh, but is Lugh useful? I gave him 4 level ups and his magic stat didn’t increase once, so I benched him. Similarly, I gave Sue about 4 level ups and her strength didn’t increase once.

Lugh is the young, green-haired mage in yellow you recruit towards the beginning, Hugh is an older mage with pink/purple hair.  Hugh has really sucky magic growths (only 30%, which is even 10% lower than Lugh's) and to top it off he joins as a level 15 mage at a time when promoted units are becoming a norm, so he's definitely not an ideal unit to use.

As far as Sue goes... eh, honestly all the bow-wielders are kind of sucky, but Dorothy and Shin are sorta the least sucky and Klein has usefulness for a time.  Shin's probably the only one really worth using because mobility is better than a 5% difference in strength and defense growths with Dorothy, and he has higher bases anyway.  For the record, Sue's strength growth is 30% and Shin's is 45%.  And no one likes the chapter where you recruit Dayan, so pretty much no one gets him.  Considering how much more useful pegasus knights are, it's understandable.

50 minutes ago, SMEDIA said:

How does the route split between 10A,11A and 10B/11B work? I visited both villages and got 10B/11B.

It's based off of whether or not you visited the right village in the northeast in 9.  If you did, you get B-route; if you didn't, you get A-route.  That's all there is to it.

52 minutes ago, SMEDIA said:

Is Noah the absolute worst of the caveliers? I used him but he got killed. At the time of his death, he was last in every stat behind the other three.

Generally speaking, the later they're recruited the worse they are.  At least in terms of cavaliers.  You should honestly only have to use Allen and Lance after shedding the usage out of Marcus, maybe one other cavalier as well if you really need that many mobile units that can tank more than two hits.

Even Zealot is more useful because he at least starts with better stats, so he can act as a sort of mid-game Jeigan or at least be on-par with some of your other units for a time.  For me, it feels like Treck and Noah sort of tie for worst cavs in the game.

[SMEDIA]

All right, thanks for all of the answers :)

[Slumber]

19 minutes ago, Ertrick36 said:

Hugh is an older mage with pink/purple hair.  Hugh has really sucky magic growths (only 30%, which is even 10% lower than Lugh's) and to top it off he joins as a level 15 mage at a time when promoted units are becoming a norm, so he's definitely not an ideal unit to use.

He joins at level 15 with incredibly good bases, comparable to a level 15/1 Lugh while still unpromoted. Again, Hugh's the RNG-safe Mage. He has the worst growths, but his bases are so rock-solid that they can carry him from recruitment, with slight speed problems. But speed is one of his highlight growths, so it won't be bad for too long. If Lugh and Lilina get screwed, he's a perfectly viable option and you can promote him immediately and have a solid Sage as soon as he's recruited.

And even with his crappy Magic growth, it still averages higher than Lugh's. Obviously not as high as Lilina, but he beats her pretty cleanly in every other stat besides Luck and Res.

He's a solid Mage, and my go-to because I'm lazy and Lugh always sucks for me.

Edited October 5, 2018 by Slumber

[Garlyle]

4 hours ago, SMEDIA said:

Now I’m not saying I didn’t enjoy playing this game for the first time with as little knowledge of what’s coming up ahead in the game, it’s just that since I obviously didn’t get the true ending, I don’t feel like I completed the game.

You see, I believe that with FE, the programers intended for the player to NEVER use save abuse of any kind. I don’t mean you’re supposed to beat the game in one sitting, it’s just that if someone dies (excluding the Lord of course) or you missed getting a useful item, you’re supposed to continue on until you beat the game or your Lord dies. If your lord dies, THEN go ahead and restart from your last save.

So anyway, I played on normal mode like this and beat Zephiel, but because I only played one Gaiden chapter, I didn’t get the true ending. Why would the programmers make the way to get the true ending contradictory to the way I played the game (which is what I believe is the intended way to play the game)?

Anyway, I of course intend to try to get the true ending, but I have a couple questions:

How does the route split between 10A,11A and 10B/11B work? I visited both villages and got 10B/11B.

I’m not sure if I’m confusing him with Hugh, but is Lugh useful? I gave him 4 level ups and his magic stat didn’t increase once, so I benched him. Similarly, I gave Sue about 4 level ups and her strength didn’t increase once.

Is Noah the absolute worst of the caveliers? I used him but he got killed. At the time of his death, he was last in every stat behind the other three.

If I risk talking to Gale in Chapter 21 with Miledy or Zeis, do I get anything? I couldn’t do it on my play through cause Miledy unfortunately died before I could recruit Zeis.

Well, beating Zephiel has some satisfaction to it I believe. Think of it how other games handle true ending, like Persona 4. I personally failed twice to achieve the true ending before getting it on hard mode.

The route split doesn't make sense here. If you visited the left village you get one of the chapters, if you visited the right you get another. You better double check that one.

It can happen with Lugh, he's very useful early game, but I usually put him to the bench once I recruit Lilina. Some character needs time to get good level ups, if you really like them, don't give up on them too early. I gave Wendy a chance, she was screwed in strength for a long time, but my investment in her paid off in the end. If you play hard mode, this might be different. As for Noah, the competition between cavaliers is big, and I think Noah is mediocre. People find Treck worse.

You don't achieve anything by talking to Gale unfortunately. I did the same thing at first, but it was my loss. If you want to get the true ending, avoid talking to him.

[Soviet Cut]

FE6 is a very bitch of a game. There are no clues for the true ending, and some requirements requires you to not play blindly (Lilina must not be killed before getting the Durandal, Elphin must not be killed before getting Armads, Sophia and that hellish chapter argh argh argh, Douglas must not be killed before getting the Aureloa and he is not even joining you in Narshe's map, Shanna, Juno and Thea must not be killed before getting the Maltet, nor Shin, Sue and Dayan before the Mulagir, and maybe Zealot too because he's the only one able to recruit Juno if I'm not mistaken, and Miredy and Zeiss before the Apocalypse, making you rush the goddamn Temple of Seals chapter, which has refs abound). Douglas is hinted, but thay doesn't make it less enfuriating. Also, the turn limit is hinted in some of them, except for the hellish desert argh argh argh, which instead makes you HAPPY because the fog stops and Roy and Merlinus talk about some damn chance of doing dammning something. And no one ever says about breaking the weapons (or not breaking the Saint Staff). FE6 is only second to Thracia 776 when it comes to bitching the game (but Thracia is a lot of fun when it comes to it, FE6 is just boring sometimes), and that's saying something. But FE6 is not unfunny, it's just boring for the most part.

Also, after playing some more of the game, I don't thing Hugh really suck that much. Okay, no base rank Bolting nor promotion, but he's a lot of fun to use and his bases aren't that bad. He's just easily outclassed by a not screwed Lugh (which is pretty common tbh) or maybe Cecilia, but she's other kind of unit.