Faellin Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 (edited) So i'm rather curious. From purely a gameplay perspective, which avatar unit breaks their respective game the absolute least? I listed Corrin 3 times since all 3 routes are majorly different and his/her performance can vary slightly per path due to a handful of factors. Also I didn't list Mark from FE7 since he basically served 0 purpose in terms of gameplay and wasn't a directly controlable avatar unit. I'm going to say Corrin, in conquest. Mostly due to how she is good. But not gamebreaking due to how well balanced the path is in terms of difficulty, Still an outstanding unit. But not the absolute best, due to having to distribute exp to other units since there is 0 grinding. So you can't just funnel every bit into Corrin and expect to have a good time. Corrin in birthright can basically solo the first half of the game with a proper pair up partner for stats, then Ryoma basically takes over. The route in general is just poorly balanced. Corrin in revelations is again, very strong, but not gamebreaking due to the first few chapters basically feeding her free levels. You can easily get her to level 10 before you even get Sakura and the first wave of hoshido characters. Leaving her massively overleveled for quite some time. Robin can solo awakening with little to no effort if you know what your doing. Even with minimal grinding. He is just that good. Kris, I don't have to much experience with since i've only fully played through that game once, but my experience is he is extremely good with the right build. Stronger then Corrin, but not on the level of Robin. So overall, for me Conquest Corrin is the most balanced. But i'm interested in seeing others thoughts on this. Edited October 27, 2018 by Faellin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geenoble Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 Why isn't Mark here? He's the most overpowered but he's still an avatar. Also Kris is from fe12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ertrick36 Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 Oh, I almost thought this was gonna be another of those "who is the strongest/weakest character" units and not be purely a discussion about how good they are as units. Robin's obviously the most OP; not only do they start in a class that does both physical and magic combat, but they also can reclass to literally every class in the game that isn't a special class. You can build Robin to destroy everything and everyone with a snap of the fingers, which is, like, twice the power of Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet. And their stats can be tailored to be optimal for a no-grind run. The only problem Robin has is weening away from reliance on Frederick within the first few chapters of Lunatic mode. Corrin is generally gonna be at least a little better than most units, even in Conquest, unless you deliberately try to make them bad. Again, Corrin pretty much has access to every class in the game that isn't special, though they would need to do some ridiculous friendship seal shenanigans to actually have access to every class at one time. And then there's the fact that in their base class, they can take on a form that makes them extra tanky at the expense of speed, so they're extremely flexible. I feel the only reason Corrin doesn't feel too OP in Conquest is because Conquest was designed in a way that you can't just have one unit steamroll everything and expect that tactic to take you through to the end of the game. Kris is the most grounded unit. Kris doesn't have access to any special classes; hell, female Kris's class list is severely limited, and even male Kris can't use every class in the game. The best thing you can do with Kris is make him fulfill a role that isn't already filled in the beginning of the game. But statistically, Kris isn't that much more impressive than most of the notorious units like Sirius or Catria, especially when you consider the fact that everyone in that game can reclass to suit their needs, while Corrin and Robin have that trait as an exclusive feature to them in their respective games. So in the end, I think Kris is the least OP avatar unit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zangetsu Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 You forgot Mark & Kiran From strongest to weakest Robin Corrin K/Chris Kiran Mark Robin is a host of Eldritch Abomination Corrin is Reindeer Dragon thing but more or less a wannabe Robin Kris from what I've read doesn't have anything remarkably special about them other being diligent in their training Kiran doesn't really do much other summon Bartes & that one random time fought Veronica Mark is pretty much dead weigh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 (edited) Kris is probably the most impactful but he's the least broken if that made sense Like if you played each of these game, one without kris, one without Robin, and one without Corrin. Corrin you barely notice because they would be a PU to lessen the headache of making them survive, and their PU would go a long way(+2 and -2 is good), and all you really lost is the OP pair up of Felicia and Jakob. Units like properly used Felicia, Jakob, Silas etc could just as well carry the game until chapter 10 where you get Camilla and yeah.... Camilla Robin is the easiest cheesemode of FE13, but playing without Robin up to Lunatic mode isn't hard since Frederick is just as able to solo the game, with backpack Chrom. Hardmode is a joke that can be soloed PU with Chrom Kris is the least broken in that for a lot of early game he literally dies in 2 hit. But not having him around changes things a whole bunch. Kris is much more likely than everyone else to reach 14 Speed to double most early game enemies, and he gets no less than 2 map where he gets 2 level early, something no other unit gets. This makes him ridiculously strong early on the game. Promote him by Chapter 4, and Kris enters the period of time where he can solo a certain parts of the map making it trivial to train up everyone else. The strongest set up of this kind is something along the lines of Fighter Kris who promotes into Dracoknight allowing you to rush through chapter 4 with ease, and chapter 4 is fucking bullshit so yeah just do it. He will maintain crazy power level that only early promoted Palla comes close The flipside to all this is of course, unlike FE13. FE12 is filled with competent units. While you are playing with losers like Sully and Stahl in 13, FE12 relatively gave you gods like Gordin, Draug, and Arran(especially with mxied reclass. Dudes amazing) even before Catria, Palla, and Caeda comes in. Technically if you focus the Altean Trio, and promote them at Chapter 2 they are almost as good as Kris(its the absurd bulk improvement you get from master seal that broke them), but yeah Honestly Malliesia is probably the only really broken unit in the game since she gave you more use of rescue staff. NOTHING is even half as good as Rescue staff. Technically Katarina since she can become Niime mk2 Edited October 27, 2018 by JSND Alter Dragon Boner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ertrick36 Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 8 hours ago, Geenoble said: Why isn't Mark here? He's the most overpowered but he's still an avatar. 5 hours ago, Zangetsu said: You forgot Mark & Kiran This is a gameplay discussion, that's why. They aren't playable units. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DisobeyedCargo Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 (edited) Wait People for robin as weakest even if it’s listed as a joke wtf robin is OP as fuck? on topic probably Kris is the weakest, robin is godly and Corrin is always a fantastic unit Edited October 27, 2018 by DisobeyedCargo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince777 Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 I don't know. They are all pretty strong and I hesitate to put Kriss last considering his stats always end up bloated above all other units in all Mmy FE12 runs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geenoble Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 (edited) Ok now a post that isn't a joke. Robin is the strongest, in fact robins probably the third best character in the series, being only beaten by Seth and Sigurd. 1-2 range, Nosferatu access, galeforce on female, all sorts of things make them good. Kris is a really good unit, but isn't the best in fe12 since the warp staff and Palla exist. I would say probbaly tied as the "weakest" avatar. I have yet to play any of the fates games, but from threads and gameplay I've seen i have a breif idea of what Corrin is like. Birthright and Revelations Corrin are both insanely good, not robin good where you solo Lunatic but still very good. Mind you those two games are quite easy apparently so theres also that. Conquest corrin isnt insanely good, but thats morely because conquest is a difficult game. I'd say birthright corrin is tied with kris for the "weakest". But Mark is the strongest because he came up with a strategy to beat Battle Before Dawn and that map fucking sucks. Edited October 28, 2018 by Geenoble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zangetsu Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 15 hours ago, Ertrick36 said: This is a gameplay discussion, that's why. They aren't playable units. As Avatar shiller, I'm incline to mention them regardless. 19 minutes ago, Geenoble said: Robin is the strongest, in fact robins probably the third best character in the series, being only beaten by Seth and Sigurd. 1-2 range, Nosferatu access, galeforce on female, all sorts of things make them good. Ok, so I know this is off topic but enlighten on why Seth & Sigurd is are the best of the best here. Like is their resistance that good or some sort of passive skill they have that makes it moot or something? Talk to me as if I was a toddler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraiza Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 Kris without a doubt, he can't juggernaut the entire game unlike Corrin and especially Robin, because FE12 enemies are just too strong for anyone to solo later on, while Awakening Lunatic just needs you to solo with robin or die to inflation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geenoble Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 22 hours ago, Zangetsu said: Ok, so I know this is off topic but enlighten on why Seth & Sigurd is are the best of the best here. Like is their resistance that good or some sort of passive skill they have that makes it moot or something? Talk to me as if I was a toddler. Seth can kill every generic enemy in one round with a javelin at base up until chapter 11, but his growths are so good that he will usually have the stats to keep one rounding. He has 8 movement, breaks the game, and is overall one of the key factors as to why Sacred stones is so easy. Robin can do all of this as well but robin requires work to be able to do this such as reclassing into hero to get sol and then reclassing again into Dark flier for gale force etc. Sigurd is just everything seth is but he can also seize thrones and has a free deployment slot.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 (edited) On 28/10/2018 at 3:29 PM, Zangetsu said: As Avatar shiller, I'm incline to mention them regardless. Ok, so I know this is off topic but enlighten on why Seth & Sigurd is are the best of the best here. Like is their resistance that good or some sort of passive skill they have that makes it moot or something? Talk to me as if I was a toddler. Seth is basically the original Fates Royals alongside Marcus. Godlike base stats, 1-2 range weapon, and unlike Marcus he dont just have a good growth - Seth have arguably the best growth out of every normal unit in GBA Fire Emblem. Combine this with Sacred Stones having hilariously weak enemies and its easy to see why hes hideously broken. Sigurd is basically what if you trade Seth Javelin with ability to seize. Using Sigurd to maximum potential would give him a 1-2 range combat and at that point the only thing that can kill him is enemy Holy Weapons. Oh yeah Sigurd also abuses a bunch of broken mechanics of FE4. The most standout being killstreaks and Console Canto. These mechanics are varied and is one of the reason Seliph is actually comparable to Sigurd in brokeness Note that the "general criteria" of broken unit in fire emblem boils down to base stats that allows then to orko everything at 1-2 range, good mobility, good alvailability, and easy to enable. While there are units that theoritically feels more broken than Sigurd Seliph and Seth at their peak(for example Naga Julia, Thracia Healer, and Rescue Staff Leif) none of them are as alvailable, easy to enable, and mobile in combo as Sigurd and Seth. Honestly in some regard the top 5 most broken unit in the series is actually along the lines of Sigurd and Seliph, Seth, Robin, Frederick, and Chrom. Edited October 29, 2018 by JSND Alter Dragon Boner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geenoble Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 14 hours ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said: Honestly in some regard the top 5 most broken unit in the series is actually along the lines of Sigurd and Seliph, Seth, Robin, Frederick, and Chrom. Don't get me wrong, Chrom's a good unit, but hes not top 5 of all time, especially when units like Haar, Pent and Titania exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slumber Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Kris, definitely. He's just a soldier. A really good soldier, but he's not terraforming the earth as he walks or a crazy undead dragon in disguise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zangetsu Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 @Geenoble & @JSND Alter Dragon Boner Thank you answering my question. I'm about play Sacred Stone so I guess I can judge if Seth lives up to the hype. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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