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Do you want Fire Emblem to be mature and realistic?


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The series just needs better writing. The problem with FE going all dark and gritty is that, at this point, it will absolutely be for shock value. Characters will die because the plot needed them too. Heck, i'd argue that Gen 1 in FE4 getting barbecued was exactly for that reason. The game wanted to do this Gen thing and the easiest way is to kill off the parents.

I don't really care what tone FE takes as long as it's written well.

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2 minutes ago, Armagon said:

The series just needs better writing. The problem with FE going all dark and gritty is that, at this point, it will absolutely be for shock value. Characters will die because the plot needed them too.

I agree. Hell we already saw this in Fates and we all know how well that turned out. Lilith and Flora's deaths were turned into jokes - not like the Genealogy barbeque one, but because they were so horribly portrayed - and Kaze died in Birthright because...he wasn't Corrin's super best friend yet, which stopped him from seeing exploding mountain crystals? The sibling deaths were even worse, and were there for cheap drama since that was the only thing Fates felt comfortable providing.

I don't think we'll see Fates quality of writing in a main installment anytime soon, but it's not "maturity" orĀ dark themes we need first and foremost, as has just been provenĀ all too painfully.

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28 minutes ago, Slumber said:

Maybe there needs to be some second thoughts that go into writing characters like Tharja and Peri, and maybe they shouldn't be treated the same way as everyone else. They used to do this. Karel's not treated the same way Barte is in FE7.

I just now see your post, and I strongly agree. Who decided that Tharja needed to be a mostly comedic character? They could have easily made her love for Robin and her attempts to be with him/her the only funny part about Tharja's character and use theĀ other supports to explore her personality, her problems to get along with the others, which could give us small clues about her backstory that would have been interesting to piece together.

And to be fair they did some stuff like that, like the support with Libra that I really like. I think it always comes down to the same thing:

More interactions that make sense and explore the character in a unique way.

Less comedic, pointless, samey bullshit.

Which doesn't mean I don't want to see comedy in some supports, just that those supports should be just a few per character

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1 hour ago, Slumber said:

Things like harming your allies and abusing your child/spouse should be treated with more weight and consequence than Awakening gives. When you're under the impression that characters like Tharja are totally fine for goofy comedy and don't at all compromise the tone of the games, this is when you start getting Peris and Camillas.

THIS. I love Awakening, but this is 100% accurate to what happened (and also why I hate Tharja). She was treated like a joke and then based on her popularity, we got Peri's and Camilla's who are even MORE troped based and worse-written than Tharja whom was already poorly written.

That's why Awakening for me was the line. It was trope-y and funny and anime-like and I laughed a lot at the game even though sometimes I did wish it was definitely a bit darker in terms of holding themes and really pulling at tension and heart strings. Whereas Fates was just painfully awful because it took the worst parts from Awakening and blew them SO far out of proportion that you ended up with awful characters that were nothing more than their boobs/incest/fetishes/murder kinks.Ā 

Echoes however I thought was genuinely a good entry to the game, because it had the genuine funny moments I loved from Awakening, but a slightly more realistic and mature take on the word (if not a bit too simplistic).

I think people think dark/edgy a lot, but honestly I think FE HAS always been mature (realism comes and goes). I just think they need to be better at playing on tensions and the mature themes they present. There's nothing worse than an amazing IDEA that has poor follow through (looking at you, Fates). SO less dark/edgy Fire Emblem, more tension.

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50 minutes ago, Thane said:

Hell we already saw this in Fates and we all know how well that turned out. Lilith and Flora's deaths were turned into jokes - not like the Genealogy barbeque one, but because they were so horribly portrayed - and Kaze died in Birthright because...he wasn't Corrin's super best friend yet, which stopped him from seeing exploding mountain crystals? The sibling deaths were even worse, and were there for cheap drama since that was the only thing Fates felt comfortable providing.

Don't forget Izuma (that was his name right?)Ā who literally died in Revelation because the writers were smoking weed at that point. How am i to believe that him using his fortune teller powers or whatever kills him in Revelation but not in Birthright?Ā 

Ā 

54 minutes ago, Thane said:

I don't think we'll see Fates quality of writing in a main installment anytime soon, but it's not "maturity" orĀ dark themes we need first and foremost, as has just been provenĀ all too painfully

Same here although no matter what, i feel that IS will still fail at writing meaningful deaths these days. For a recent example, look at Gunnthra in Heroes. IS snapped their fingers and Gunnthra ceased to exist.

If i'm gonna be honest, i'm expecting at least two really bullshit deaths in Three Houses.

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okay first of all I just wanna point out that tharja isn't a yandere. She is VERY similiar to one but isn't one by technicality.A yandere starts "deredere" then when you get to know her that's when her true colors start to show and that's when the crazy comes out. Tharja does not have that "deredere" mask so to speak.

5 hours ago, Thane said:

Discussing "maturity" like this is a bit weird. I think a lot of people have different interpretations of what exactly that means

which is why I hate that term when critiquing storiesĀ . I mean what do people mean by "mature storytelling"? is it tackling "mature" themes? then that brings up the question of what "mature" theme even is. is it when only a "mature" mind can understand it properly? Well in that case every story has those themes technically. I mean when you really stand to think about it even the themes of F*cking Barney the dinosaur can be considered mature cause the whole point of the themes of that show is to help kids mature by teaching them very basic life lessons like not being an asshole. You need to be mature(or at least mature enough) to fully understand what the show is trying to say. I mean it's not nuanced or subtle at all but still. This why to me there is no such thing as "mature" or "immature" writing. only good or bad writing. to say a story is poorly written because it's "not mature" is, ironically, a sign of immaturity.

also @SunsurgeĀ you took the words right out of my mouth. I could not have said it better myself.

Edited by Otts486
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9 hours ago, PeaceRibbon said:

Realism is something most people play video games to get away from and I think IĀ speak for all of us when I say we shouldn't get rid of our blue haired boys anytime soon.

But in terms of maturity, I think people feel the more goofy characters and provocative character designs of more recent entries clashed a bit too much with what had come before. I can handle the lighter tone, in fact at times I like it more, but in older games there was a level of respect for the humanity of the characters to the point where sometimes almost all characters had elements of their character or background that felt believable, even the comedic ones! I think in general what the general fandom wants is more games where each support offers something new to the characters as opposed to Awakening and Fates where you haft to sift through dozens of samey conversations in order to find that tasty ingot of character depth.Ā 

I haven't read all the posts, but this is basically my opinion. I'm cool with silly/goofy, but depth is a must. But the real thing I want is a sense of reverence and seriousness, for the most part. We shouldn't completely throw out dignity. Treat death with the solemnness it deserves, and a casual chat between friends with the lightness it deserves. Give the characters depth, too. Complex emotions, unique but believable backstory, etc. Really, the best way any writer can go about storytelling is to get to know the characters, provide situations, and let said characters react to those situations. Then, record the results. Let the characters carry the story. And please, please don't rely on fanservice! I miss the days when FE was clean and characters had self-respect. (I.e., Titainia is large-chested, but she values her vital organs and so covers up with armor that can actually protect her. Further, she has enough self-respect not to let just anyone look at her body, so she dresses modestly. Just because she has large breasts doesn't mean she has to show them off, and just because she doesn't show them off doesn't mean she has to show upper thigh. This is a lady I can respect, and not just me. Because she treats herself with respect, and others with respect, she garners the respect of other people. Positive role model.) IS can do what they want since it's their product, but there are reasons why FE9 is my favorite FE. FE7 and FE8 are also quality games, and what drew me into this series was the character depth, with each character being their own person. It's what made FE unique: the vast number of characters who develop individually, apart from the main storyline.

Now, don't get me wrong, there were certainly enjoyable bits in Awakening, and FE10 had praiseworthy gameplay, graphics, and music, but as for my own personal preference? The best thing for a story is for the characters to be believable because they have depth, and for them to be the ones determining where the story goes, not the other way around. (To be clear, I'm not saying that events in the story can't influence characters. That would be bad writing. But rather, asking "does it make sense for this character to go to this place under these circumstances, or am I trying to force the character to do something he/she wouldn't do for the sake of where I as the writer want to take the story?" Shinon and Gatrie making their respective choices (I'm trying to avoid spoiling people who may be interested in playing the game) in FE9 is a prime example of this writing done right.)

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13 minutes ago, Sunsurge said:

THIS. I love Awakening, but this is 100% accurate to what happened (and also why I hate Tharja). She was treated like a joke and then based on her popularity, we got Peri's and Camilla's who are even MORE troped based and worse-written than Tharja whom was already poorly written.

That's why Awakening for me was the line. It was trope-y and funny and anime-like and I laughed a lot at the game even though sometimes I did wish it was definitely a bit darker in terms of holding themes and really pulling at tension and heart strings. Whereas Fates was just painfully awful because it took the worst parts from Awakening and blew them SO far out of proportion that you ended up with awful characters that were nothing more than their boobs/incest/fetishes/murder kinks.Ā 

Echoes however I thought was genuinely a good entry to the game, because it had the genuine funny moments I loved from Awakening, but a slightly more realistic and mature take on the word (if not a bit too simplistic).

I think people think dark/edgy a lot, but honestly I think FE HAS always been mature (realism comes and goes). I just think they need to be better at playing on tensions and the mature themes they present. There's nothing worse than an amazing IDEA that has poor follow through (looking at you, Fates). SO less dark/edgy Fire Emblem, more tension.

Echoes gave me hope for future installments honestly, it seemed like a good mix of taking itself seriously and being funny, and it was funny at the right times just like in @Shoblongoo's example. Just like they were talking about in that example Fire Emblem does have its light hearted moments mixed in, but in previous games and in Echoes I rarely saw it detract from the tone of the game.

Ā 

Let's think of Sacred Stones for a second..... The game has a DnD level story but some of the characters make it low-key one of the darker games in the franchise (Look at Orson or some of Valters DialogueĀ Ā to Eirika) and even what Gheb says to Tana is really Screwed up (Even though it gave us a laugh). Sacred Stones managed to put light hearted characters in a really screwed up situation and had a pretty sober ending for a fire emblem game, I want to see characters handled like that mixed in with good writing.

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10 hours ago, PeaceRibbon said:

Realism is something most people play video games to get away from and I think IĀ speak for all of us when I say we shouldn't get rid of our blue haired boys anytime soon.

But in terms of maturity, I think people feel the more goofy characters and provocative character designs of more recent entries clashed a bit too much with what had come before. I can handle the lighter tone, in fact at times I like it more, but in older games there was a level of respect for the humanity of the characters to the point where sometimes almost all characters had elements of their character or background that felt believable, even the comedic ones! I think in general what the general fandom wants is more games where each support offers something new to the characters as opposed to Awakening and Fates where you haft to sift through dozens of samey conversations in order to find that tasty ingot of character depth.Ā 

Wow, that pretty much sums up my thoughts on this topic.
I especiallyĀ missed the level of respect the characters had, and of course how much more characters were grounded in their world.
Fortunately Echoes did bring back much of what I missed about the series.

Ā 

2 hours ago, Thane said:

Right-o, that was my point, thoughĀ I wouldn't exactly call an unhinged serial killer who loudly states his intention to kill people of the party at a later date to have a "little messed up" thought process. Again, that's pretty much the Black Fang, the same unsympathetic twats you spend most of the game fighting. There is no complexity here.

...Odd that doesn't really line up with how the game portrays theĀ Black Fang and it's original leaders.
Ā 

2 hours ago, omegaxis1 said:

It still doesn't make the biggest case of how he changed from a psychotic murderer to a saint that became all calm. Hell, even their support makes little sense in how Karel just felt "calmer" because it felt like a dramatic shift.Ā 

When I first played Binding Blade I just assumed it was due to age. (A lot can change in 20 years)
40 isn't all that old but it's certainly enough for him to be like a retired football playerĀ (for lack of a better example.), years of rough activity can wearĀ one down once it catches up.

Though when I did get all the supports in Blazing Sword, Lucius' and Karel's conversation did indeedĀ actually support this.

Quote

Lucius: ā€¦You look tired.
Karel: ā€¦What?
Lucius: Your face seems pallid, drawn, and worn. It looks unhealthy.
Karel: Perhapsā€¦I amā€¦tired. When I fight, my entire body is filled with a hunger I cannot suppress. ā€¦I have never had the luxury even to imagine fatigueā€¦


That aside though, I think Karel's and Karla's conversation played a huge role.

Quote

Karel: Karlaā€¦. Are you ready?
Karla: Yes. Do as you wish, Brother. When I fall to you, I will leave no regrets.
Karel: ā€¦ā€¦
Karla: We are less than human now. We are no different from our swords themselves. Our hearts are cold, and we count the days we live solely by the flesh we cleave. What meaning can there be in such an existence?
Karel: ā€¦ā€¦
Karla: Cut me down, Brother. I simply wanted to hear your voice before I died. Now I have. I am satisfied.
Karel: ā€¦ā€¦
Karla: ā€¦ā€¦
Karel: Karlaā€¦ You havenā€™t changed. But I have. I must have. When I am with you, I remember the past.
Karla: Brotherā€¦
Karel: Go where you will. I will not fight you.
Karla: Brotherā€¦ Brother, what will you do?
Karel: Wellā€¦
Karla: I wonā€™t stop youā€¦ I doubt you can resist the destiny of our blood for longā€¦ So I will wait for you. On the scarlet plain. I will wait for my brother to come homeā€¦
Karel: ā€¦ā€¦

This is the first time Karel turned down a fight from someone he sought to battle for a long time, which is big since Karel would travel across the continent to just battle someone.
Now what?Ā  He doesn't want to fight his sister anymore and said he wouldn't, but if he keeps on searching for more targets to kill then what would stop him from being drawn back toĀ the "destiny of their blood"?Ā  Something needed to change.Ā  (Then there's the bit whereĀ KarlaĀ mentions the vanity of their current existence, whichĀ in a way complements Karel's conversation with Lucius.)

So with Karel's ending, I feel like his conversation with Karla was what ultimately prompted the change in Karel.

Quote

Karel ā€“ Saint of Swords
Once, Karel was known as the Sword Demon. Now, he bears a new name. What prompted this change, he will not say.

Ā 

Edited by Puzzle044
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The problem with Awakening and Fates is caused by inconsistent writing and tone.Ā 

Even Shonen anime, which I see in these posts saying it's the reason why the above games' writing isn't mature, knows when and when to handle the appriopriate tone to the appropriate character/s in a appropriate scene.

This is evident with Tharja and Peri.

Especially Tharja, which is sad because her supports with Libra, Lon'qu, Nowi andKellam shows her good side while still being a creepy dark mage.

The problem is that she is forced by the game writing to be obssessed with the avatar and her still abusing Noire despite her supports with Noire not to follow her future self's actions hurts her character.

And Peri's writing problems have been dicussed to death.

If the Awakening and Fate had excellent writing and consistent, then all the complaints regarding it's character design or character being less serious would be excused or would just be a minor factor.

Ā 

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Can I just preface that Fates IS NOT shounen style storytelling. Or at the very least it doesnā€™t feel like that to me. As someone who has watched all of the big three, Mha, fairytail, and a little bit of dragon ball I can tell you with certainty that fates does not feel anything like any of those shows at all. Awakening does however and while not the best, I feel it does a competent job at conveying those core themes that the genre is known for. Fates on the other hand feels like your typicalĀ light novel isekai harem garbage. Filled with all the otaku fetishes a man could ever hope for with a mary sue protagonist that everyone likes because reasons. Honestly itā€™s a stoneā€™s throw away from sh*t like the asterisk war or sao. The only reason I put fates above them is because fates has some good characters to be found if you look.

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2 hours ago, Otts486 said:

Fates on the other hand feels like your typicalĀ light novel isekai harem garbage.Ā 

I actually kind of get this.

I'd say Fire Emblem should avoid using broad anime genres like isekais and shounen, but people say the Tellius series is super shounen-y, and they actually managed to pull that one off.

Edited by Slumber
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2 minutes ago, Slumber said:

I actually kind of get this.

I'd say Fire Emblem should avoid using broad anime genres like isekais and shounen, people say the Tellius series is super shounen-y, and they actually managed to pull that one off.

Is it because of the fact without Ike, Laguz-Beorc relations would remain distant and hated while the likes of Ashnard would succeed with his plans?

Ā 

Ike is basically a medieval superman.

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Maturity. yes, realism? Well it depends on what you mean.

Ā 

I don't see a need to ditch the anime hair, magic, Pegasus knights, etc. or have a cast of entirely serious characters, but I don't think that's what you're getting at. In a perfect world I would have IS take some writing advice from the people who developed the civil war story arc from Skyrim. People found it mature and 'realistic' because it gave you two sides with real flaws and benefits, two equally respectable leaders for both sides of the conflict, as well as real reasons to support either side that you could see being actual important issues, if said world was real. The fact that people actually did debate over it as if it were serious business speaks to that. How often do you see an actual discussion about if Nohr or Hoshido is the better option based not on gameplay preference but lore?

Ā 

Ā 

My problem with the 3DS era of fire emblem is that it seems almost scared to take itself seriously. 90% of supports are about that characters gimmick that supposedly makes them endearing. (Awakening in particular suffers from this) 'Just look at them, they're all so quirky and lovable' says an increasingly smaller number of people as they start to prefer the 10% of serious moments that give the characters actual depth. Plenty of gritty things happen in these games but we don't notice because the game doesn't want to show us.Ā 

Spoiler

The Chevois massacre, Corrin being forced to kill the rainbow sage, Robin being the vessel of the closest thing fire emblem has to Satan. All of these become increasingly screwed up opportunities for drama the more you think about them but the game ignores, no. distains them because it fears complexity, why? I'd say greed but that's perhaps a topic for a different thread.

Ā 

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10 minutes ago, Spatha said:

Is it because of the fact without Ike, Laguz-Beorc relations would remain distant and hated while the likes of Ashnard would succeed with his plans?

Ā 

Ike is basically a medieval superman.

Kinda that.

But if you take Ike's journey as the main throughline of the Tellius games, it follows the typical arc and power escalation of a shounen series.

Ike starts off as a naive young, inexperienced kid. Suddenly, a great responsibility is thrust upon him when his father dies, he establishes a clear rivalry with an evil counterpart to himself, and he gradually works his way up through the world by being so good at fighting. Eventually he gets a magical sword that'll let him fight evenly with the stronger people in the story, he acquires strength to beat his rival, and finallyĀ he takes down the big bad of the first major arc. Shortly after, the viewers are let known that there are more things going on behind the scenes than Ike knows of.

THEN TIMESKIP

Ike spends his timeskip as a huge training arc, regularly training alongside people who were once the strongest people in the story(Like Caineghis), and he builds up a reputation that makes himself a known quantity in his world. He learns that his rival is still alive, and he learns of the plot behind everything. He gets more magic upgrades that lets him fight on the level he needs to,Ā he defeats the masterminds, finally definitively beats his rival, and beats a GOD.

And then he wanders off, presumably to become even stronger.

He's got the personality and interests(IE he likes to fight, his friends,Ā eat a ton, and is entirely asexual) of a typical shounen protagonist as well.

Edited by Slumber
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I'm not sure about a "mature"/"dark" tone, mainly because no FE has ever gone full mature and dark. Even Thracia 776 had its light moments and comic relief characters.

That being said, FE has moved towards a tone commonly found in shonen anime, which is where a lot of the fighting within the fandom is caused. Because this tone attracted a larger audience at the expense of the older fans having to lose the tone they've grown to love in FE. There is a way to balance lighthearted elements with heavier ones, it's just that FE still needs to figure that out.

The most loved stories (emphasis on stories, not gameplay) is Genealogy and PoR. What these two stories have in common are well fleshed out worlds- although they both have high-fantasy settings, there was adequate reasoning to justify it. We get to see the supernatural elements in play and how if affects characters. Because of this, we have characters that are shaped by their world instead of a cast that shapes the world, like Awakening and Fates' casts. Not to say FE4 & 9 aren't character driven, but each character has a justification for why they're fighting, and that justification is reflected onto the established world that we know.

These stories also use politics to drive their plots. Political alliances and how their beliefs (which can be tied to the religion that was established) affect how characters are aligned. This can cause for some unusual allies as well as sympathetic antagonists (Camuses). Politics also show how the country is run, and how powerless the Crown can be at times. Politics generally help characterize the villains of FE, and which was something missing in the 3DS titles. All 3 3DS titles fall a little short on the villain development side (less so SoV), and this can be partly due to the lack of political intrigue explored.Ā 

The biggest let downs for me story-wise for the 3DS games was the lack of attention to world building and antagonists. I'm ok with the lighter tone, but I feel FE stories are at their best when they properly develop their world and villains. It's not so much the tone that's important, but what's developed in my opinion.

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8 hours ago, Armagon said:

Don't forget Izuma (that was his name right?)Ā who literally died in Revelation because the writers were smoking weed at that point. How am i to believe that him using his fortune teller powers or whatever kills him in Revelation but not in Birthright?Ā 

There's a pretty funny fan theory that Izama isn't actually died but just pretended to be dying to motivate Takumi and that while everyone is fighting he's cheerfully having a vacation in the beach realm. Its actually pretty in character.Ā 

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53 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

There's a pretty funny fan theory that Izama isn't actually died but just pretended to be dying to motivate Takumi and that while everyone is fighting he's cheerfully having a vacation in the beach realm. Its actually pretty in character.Ā 

That'd be pretty great, honestly.Ā 

I've got a theory that Azura never tried writing about Valla; the curse only works if its name is spoken. Maybe she can't write.

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4 hours ago, Etrurian emperor said:

There's a pretty funny fan theory that Izama isn't actually died but just pretended to be dying to motivate Takumi and that while everyone is fighting he's cheerfully having a vacation in the beach realm. Its actually pretty in character.Ā 

lol thats a good one.

If I actually cared enough about revelations to have head-canon for it, that would be my new head-canon.
Ā 

10 hours ago, Slumber said:

people say the Tellius series is super shounen-y

Who says that?

Tellius does a better job respectfully and intelligently handling adult themes of racism, religiosity, war crimes, and government corruption than any shonen I've ever seen.Ā Ā Ā 

Edited by Shoblongoo
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39 minutes ago, Shoblongoo said:

Tellius does a better job respectfully and intelligently handling adult themes of racism, religiosity, war crimes, and government corruption than any shonen I've ever seen.Ā  Ā 

You should read HunterXHunter.Ā 

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56 minutes ago, Shoblongoo said:

lol thats a good one.

If I actually cared enough about revelations to have head-canon for it, that would be my new head-canon.
Ā 

Who says that?

Tellius does a better job respectfully and intelligently handling adult themes of racism, religiosity, war crimes, and government corruption than any shonen I've ever seen.Ā Ā Ā 

Ah, IMO the praise regarding Tellius' core focus regarding Racism to be a bit overrated.

While respectful and maturely written for a Nintendo game, It doesn't explore the complicated causes and reasons of racism and slavery in history beyond "that's evil and wrong".

It doesn't help that the Laguz are of the innocent Noble Savage who did nothing wrong and that the Humans are always evil or flawed beings who need to be corrected.

Edited by Spatha
minor errors
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53 minutes ago, Shoblongoo said:

Tellius does a better job respectfully and intelligently handling adult themes of racism, religiosity, war crimes, and government corruption than any shonen I've ever seen.Ā Ā Ā 

Really? I certainly haven't seen the beorc really hold much of a high ground or any form of real justification about why the laguz should be hated. If anything, all that we see is reasons to hate the beorcĀ and see the laguz as the better people. Sephiran did horrible stuff, but all a result of more on the beorcs being horrible.Ā 

And I certainlyĀ didn't see a bit of any actual Branded persecution.

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2 hours ago, Spatha said:

While respectful and maturely written for a Nintendo game, It doesn't explore the complicated causes and reasons of racism and slavery in history beyond "that's evil and wrong".

Ā 

2 hours ago, omegaxis1 said:

Really? I certainly haven't seen the beorc really hold much of a high ground or any form of real justification about why the laguz should be hated.


Racism is evil and wrong and the hatreds born therefrom areĀ inherently unjustifiable--but there's a childish, cartoonish way to play with that theme. And a intelligent, adult way to explore it.

Having a cartoon villain like Hans or Iago butchering "filthy subhuman" kitsune, and a writer's pet simpleton like Corrin running around crying about how wrong that is + [insert grade school level anti-racist bumper here]?

That's the childish, cartoonish way to do it.

What Tellius does to treat the theme maturely is not reduce the racists to cartoon villains--it explores how insidiously pervasive it really is, and how widespread and influential it can be amongst otherwise good and reasonable people. (the port scene in Crimea comes to mind)

It explores how racism becomes particularly alluring to the masses in times of troubleĀ when people need a scapegoat for their problems. And how persons in positions of power purposefully stir up racism + use it as a weapon to redirect anger and outrage and distract the masses from their own wrongdoing. (i.e. The Serenes Massacre)

It explores how no one is born racist--racismĀ is a learned behavior--and how what is learned can be unlearned through worldliness and travel and actually coming into contact with + forming real relationships with people you've never actually interacted with, but have been raised to hate. (i.e. Jill's supports and character development)

It explores the difference between institutional racism as a matter of law and policy and pervasive societal racism, and illustrates howĀ just because the former has been abolished that doesn't necessarily translate into progress on the latter,Ā  something a shocking number of people in real life don't even seem to understand. (i.eĀ The Kings of Gallia and Crimea are friendly and have endorsed the idea that as a matter of policy, there should be peace between their kingdoms and friendship and equality between their people. The average citizens of Gallia and Crimea scoff at thisĀ and are still hella racist. The Apostle of Begnion herself has officially outlawed Laguz slavery and decreed fairĀ treatment of Laguz--but that doesn't even come close to the reality of actual societal attitudes or life in Begnion.)

It explores the way people twist religious doctrines to support whatever racist ideologies they want to believe are morally correct and infer an ordained "natural order of things" in psuedo-intellectual support of racist ideas, when no such doctrines or natural order actually exist. How history and philosophy and scripture gets distorted by the need to try andĀ justify the unjustifiable, and underlying falsehoods eventually just go unquestioned + get so ingrained in the culture that they are accepted as truth. But really--its all just a society with a moral cancer at its heart trying to rationalize hate and prejudice.Ā Ā (i.e. Stefan's conversation with Goddess Yune in RD Part 4 right before your party heads into The Tower)


Yune: Are you here to talk to me? Or to Micaiah?
Stefan: Iā€™m here to speak with you, Yune.
Yune: Youā€™re very strange. What are you?
Stefan: Thatā€™s a strange question, especially coming from you. Didnā€™t you create all of us?
Yune: I didnā€™t create anything. Not laguz nor beorc. But I know what they are, because Iā€™ve watched them change and grow over time. Youā€¦ Youā€™re not something Iā€™ve seen before.
Stefan: Iā€™m the same as the girl you dwell inside.
Yune: Ohhhā€¦ I thought Micaiah was the only one. She could hear my voice and sing the galdr of release. But I learned that others existed. Thereā€™s that boy whoā€™s always with Ike. Or the little girl who stays by the queen of Crimea.
Stefan: There are several in my village, as well. They are my comrades. We all live under the same fateā€¦and carry the same curse in our blood.
Yune: When you say these words, what do they mean? Why are you cursed?
Stefan: It means that we carry the blood of both beorc and laguz. Beorc call us Branded, and laguz call us parentless.
Yune: Does that mean your parents are beorc and laguz?
Stefan: Not always. It means that laguz and beorc mixed blood somewhere along the line. Beorc and laguz rarely associate in that way. For them to conceive a child together is an even rarer event. Whatā€™s strange is that the child bears no laguz characteristics. Itā€™s just a normal beorc infant. However, the laguz blood lies asleep, waiting, in the childā€™s veins.
Yune: Ohā€¦
Stefan: One day, the laguz blood shows itself, marking the childā€™s body with a brand. How old is that girl, hmm? I donā€™t think sheā€™s as young as she looks. The other curse is that we age differently from beorc. It depends on what laguz blood the child has, but it always slows how fast we age.
Yune: Micaiah says thatā€™s true. Sheā€™s listening to every word you say. Please, continue.
Stefan: The laguz blood gives the Branded unnatural powers. Beorc fear and distrust us because they canā€™t understand those abilities. The laguz are even worse. They treat us like weā€™re phantoms, refusing to acknowledge us, as if we donā€™t even exist.
Yune: I seeā€¦
Stefan: Itā€™s easy to hide among beorcs. You just cover the brand, avoid getting close to anyone, and never settle down. Pretending youā€™re normal. The laguz are different. They can sense what we areā€¦ They have an instinct for it. Not all laguz know for sure, but the sharp ones figure it out instantly. Others just feel uneasy around us. Some never figure it out, but theyā€™re surrounded by ones who do. Either way, the laguz would never talk to us voluntarily. Why would you pay attention to someone who doesnā€™t even exist?
Yune: Why? That doesnā€™t make any sense. How did things get like that?
Stefan: I would like to know that as well. Itā€™s said that a union between laguz and beorc is a crime against the goddess. Thatā€™s what weā€™ve always been told.
Yune: Thatā€™s silly. Iā€™ve never heard anything of the sort.
Stefan: ā€¦Hehā€¦ Hehehā€¦ Hahahahahaā€¦!
Yune: Why are you laughing?
Stefan: Itā€™s all been a lie! For hundreds of years, weā€™ve faced persecution, abuse, and isolation. And for what? A lie! Whatā€™s not to laugh about, huh? Hahahaā€¦
Yune: Whatā€™s happened? This is all wrongā€¦ How did history get so distorted? Was it at a particular place and time? I donā€™t understand. Iā€™ve been asleep for too longā€¦

^^^
For all the maligning of Radiant Dawn's final arc, that's one of my favorite scenes in any fire emblem title

________

There's alot to appreciate about the way Tellius handles the theme.

And its something we haven't really seen fleshed out like that in any other Fire Emblem; that dimension of the setting and the presence of that moral and cultural conflict that is all too recognizable from life in the real world is a large part of what IMO goes the extra mile towards making Tellius feel like such a richly developed setting.Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā 

Ā 

Edited by Shoblongoo
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