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Special Heroes (Gifts of Winter)


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16 minutes ago, XRay said:

They do not have to address PvP issues with the same urgency, but they should at least give players a reply to let us know they heard us and are working on it. A simple Tweet on Twitter to tell us they will figure something out to address player's complaints against Dancers/Singers and ponies in Aether Raids would do wonders, and it would also give players like me who enjoy the mode without the BST crap time to reply and present our arguments. An easy immediate compromise would be to make Tactics Room (O) affect three columns like Schools (O).

PvP also is not the only issue that they are slow at addressing. Some players want more diversity in New Heroes Foci and not as much alt spam. A lot of players do not want to wake up in the middle of the night to catch the Voting Gauntlet multipliers. There are still crap in the 5* pool that players do not want to summon, like Mist and a whole bunch of sword units.

The only time that I remember Heroes doing something quickly was to reduce the enemy stats in Relay Defense.

Maybe it is a cultural thing and demanding better communication is too much to ask for.

If they would just communicate, western players would be a lot more understanding and patient. Even the slowness can be easily excusable if they present the cost cutting, or whatever that is causing slowness in Heroes, as a way to spend more resources on Three Houses.

Orrrr, you could understand cultural differences more and not be so quick to lose patience in the first place. It's a bit self-centered to think they need to be more communicative to make western players happy. Honestly, Western culture could just stand to be MORE understanding and patient in the first place. Furthermore, even in our culture, companies are NOT that open about what's going on. 

Also, player's complain about everything. Nobody is going to be happy. I personally don't find any issues about refresher units+ponies in Aether Raids. I find the best strategies to counter them (the point of the game). A lot of players don't care about Voting Gauntlet multipliers because it's just a mobile game, so why wake up in the middle of the night for it? How are they gonna fix that for a small minority of players? Yes they can clean up the 5* pool, but honestly they probably make more money from it being bloated, so from that standpoint it makes sense to be slow about addressing t.

They don't need to TELL you they're cutting costs or spending more resources on Three Houses, and realistically knowing all the legal hoops a company has to jump through (working in Advertising/PR) it makes sense they're not going that in depth. They do communicate (slowly) and if you've been playing heroes since the beginning you should KNOW they move slow, so like ... why don't you have patience?

And they already explained finding artists/producing assets/recording VO's and programming takes months. Do they really need to explain WHY as well for people to suddenly have patience and understanding?

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2 minutes ago, Sunsurge said:

And they already explained finding artists/producing assets/recording VO's and programming takes months. Do they really need to explain WHY as well for people to suddenly have patience and understanding?

Even if they did, they'd get the armchair developers now coming up with ways they think the process could be streamlined and complaining that they aren't doing that, despite their ideas not actually working for one reason or another.

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7 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

 

Shut your mouths, shut your mouths right now!!

Seriously though, I'm furious. Eirika's adorable and her kit is really interesting (just give her a Spd Tactic seal and she can almost fully buff any Bladetome unit), but they just had to make this right before CYL3, didn't they?  This is an Eiricav situation all over again, are they intentionally doing this to make sure at least one 3DS/ Heroes girl wins each year? I mean, I don't want to say they're intentionally sabotaging her, but...

---

Anyway, I'm not a fan of the armours either, but eh. As long as I stay in and around T18 in Arena I'm fine. Also, I guess everyone expecting a healer!Eirika was right, but this isn't the alt we wanted...

Is Eirika the new Camilla? She got three alts in one year. This means Micaiah's chances of winning CYL3 have increased. 

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9 minutes ago, Othin said:

You might think certain statements would make you personally more satisfied, but it doesn't necessarily go for players as a whole. Explaining some things can lead to all sorts of other complaints from people who think they know how it could be done better, as we saw from the deluge of complaints over the FE6/10 banner announcement from people who wanted those banners.

I think it is better to give out that news than not to give it out. Given the choice between knowing and not knowing when those Foci will come out, I think most players would choose to know. I have not heard a player who complained about the news to prefer that the company stay silent about it.

7 minutes ago, Sunsurge said:

Orrrr, you could understand cultural differences more and not be so quick to lose patience in the first place. It's a bit self-centered to think they need to be more communicative to make western players happy. Honestly, Western culture could just stand to be MORE understanding and patient in the first place. Furthermore, even in our culture, companies are NOT that open about what's going on. 

32 minutes ago, Sunsurge said:

They don't need to TELL you they're cutting costs or spending more resources on Three Houses, and realistically knowing all the legal hoops a company has to jump through (working in Advertising/PR) it makes sense they're not going that in depth. They do communicate (slowly) and if you've been playing heroes since the beginning you should KNOW they move slow, so like ... why don't you have patience?

By law, publicly traded American companies are required to file an annual report and be open to a certain degree. It does not have to be super detailed into everything, but it should contain all known material information that could influence an investor's decision to invest. In my opinion, if Nintendo were an American company, I expect to find more information on how well their mobile segment is doing, as all the information that I can find so far are vague and not very helpful.

I do not expect them to be like Blizzard or EA to communicate that well, but they are an international company and I do expect them to communicate well enough with a third of their market.

23 minutes ago, Sunsurge said:

Also, player's complain about everything. Nobody is going to be happy. I personally don't find any issues about refresher units+ponies in Aether Raids. I find the best strategies to counter them (the point of the game). A lot of players don't care about Voting Gauntlet multipliers because it's just a mobile game, so why wake up in the middle of the night for it? How are they gonna fix that for a small minority of players? Yes they can clean up the 5* pool, but honestly they probably make more money from it being bloated, so from that standpoint it makes sense to be slow about addressing t.

I do not find an issue with ponies or Dancers/Singers either, but a significant number of players are, and I think their concerns should be heard and replied to, because what those players do and say affects me. I do not want Aether Raids to be another mode tainted by the BST bull crap we have now in Arena and Arena Assault. I want to give my feedback in favor of keeping the status quo.

Fire Emblem Heroes is just a mobile game, but it does not kill them to give players some more quality of life improvements for Voting Gauntlet like they did with Tempest Trials. A simple way to make life easier on players is to choose the highest multiplier that happened within in the last 3 or 4 hours, so players do not have to feel like they missed out on a multiplier when they sleep.

From a business stand point, yes, they should keep the 5* pools bloated, but at the very least they should communicate to players why they are doing so.

33 minutes ago, Sunsurge said:

And they already explained finding artists/producing assets/recording VO's and programming takes months. Do they really need to explain WHY as well for people to suddenly have patience and understanding?

38 minutes ago, Othin said:

Even if they did, they'd get the armchair developers now coming up with ways they think the process could be streamlined and complaining that they aren't doing that, despite their ideas not actually working for one reason or another.

Management had almost 2 years to improve their workflow. I do not know for sure how long it takes, but it feels like it takes them 6 months to a full year to create a Focus, and that is abysmally slow. I have not played other gacha games, but I do not hear about Heroes players who play other gacha games praise how fast Heroes is. In my opinion, taking 6 months to respond to customer demands as a gacha game is unacceptable.

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Don't care much for Sacred Stones. It just might be my least favourite Fire Emblem game and I've never liked Ephraim. 

Cecilia looks stunning shedding some armour though. I'm excited that we're getting her for free.

Edited by Vince777
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No fliers. Check.

Binding Blade. Check.

I was so close to completely skip this banner but then they had to put Ephraim and Eirika on it. Couldn't they just put Tellius or SoV on it, fans of these games would have deserved something anyway.

Oh well, this banner will be around for some time. The legendary banner comes an goes, the New Year banner comes and even the January new units banner, while this will still be around, so I will wait and see. At least there are just 3 units on it, so it won't be as annoying to get something.

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1 hour ago, Othin said:

despite their ideas not actually working for one reason or another.

You know, from personal experience, half the reason those ideas don't work is because managers/clients are impatient. Test automation and coverage is a huge factor in speeding up the development life cycle and decreasing errors getting into production. Getting that coverage up takes time, sometimes a lot. You know what happens when you tell managers that? "They're just tests." Basically, you're sacrificing longterm maintainability for a slightly earlier release date. Scope creep is another big issue. Guess what happens when you bring that up. "It's just one more feature." Those"one more feature"s add up.*

Don't get me wrong, I think IS could improve in places, but as a whole I think they're doing a fine job. It's just that everyone acting like development studios don't have ways they could improve are just as blind as the ones acting like they're completely incompetent.

*Source: it's my job.

Edited by bottlegnomes
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1 hour ago, Icelerate said:

Is Eirika the new Camilla? She got three alts in one year. This means Micaiah's chances of winning CYL3 have increased. 

That's the most painful comparison I've ever heard xD If only alts were as damaging to Eirika's CYL chances as they are for Camilla (i.e. barely, if at all).

Micaiah winning as a result is the only silver lining to this, though I suspect Camilla and Loki will both get in instead if this alt really does destroy Eirika's chances (partly due to cynicism, but also because they were in the top 5 alongside Eirika).

...this is the worst Christmas gift ever - it's certainly the most backhanded one!

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23 minutes ago, DefyingFates said:

That's the most painful comparison I've ever heard xD If only alts were as damaging to Eirika's CYL chances as they are for Camilla (i.e. barely, if at all).

Micaiah winning as a result is the only silver lining to this, though I suspect Camilla and Loki will both get in instead if this alt really does destroy Eirika's chances (partly due to cynicism, but also because they were in the top 5 alongside Eirika).

...this is the worst Christmas gift ever - it's certainly the most backhanded one!

Loki's votes were probably in large part because of her not having any playable version, and now she has one. So her chances should go down correspondingly as well.

Looking at top CYL2 characters and how their version numbers have changed since then:

  • 5. Marth: 1 > 3
  • 6. Camilla: 3 > 5
  • 7. Eirika: 2 > 4 (or 1 > 4, counting from when the vote started)
  • 8. Azura: 3 > 4
  • 9. Alm: 1 (no change)
  • 10. Loki: 0 > 1
  • 11. Reinhardt: 1 > 2
  • 12. Nino: 1 > 2
  • 13. Micaiah: 1 > 2
  • 14. Corrin (F): 2 > 3
  • 15. Chrom: 3 > 4
  • 16. Tharja: 2 > 3
  • 17. Robin (M): 2 > ...does Grima count as a third?
  • 18. Takumi: 2 > 4
  • 19. Cordelia: 2 > 3
  • 20. Leif: 0 > 1

So everyone except Alm and arguably Robin (M) got at least one more version, with Marth, Camilla, Eirika, and Takumi each getting multiple. Eirika is the only character to get three new versions since the start of CYL2.

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There's a strong bias against player phase units even though they are much harder to use and much less problematic.  Thing is they take real skill, not just inching one's infinite bulk mixed phase unit forward with triangle advantage.  Which I guess many people complaining about ponies and refreshers want to do.  Surtr is actually getting some heat cause his bulk is to that much of a ridiculous level and how it works in Aether raids along with that C skill.  They are already tilting in favor of enemy/mixed phase units but if they tilt completely that way I'm out, sorry but it is too boring.  I've playing long enough that walking a tank up for no damage, and killing in response has lost any small sense of satisfaction it had.  

On topic though. The biggest + is wow no Fates/Awakening units.  This is only the second banner in the entire near 2 years of this game which has done that.  The last was way back near the beginning of this year.  That was of course after a year of near 100% Fates/Awakening units on seasonal banners, with the lone exception being the Bridal banner which was still half Fates/Awakening.  Really if things were fair (which of course they aren't) we wouldn't see another Fates/Awakening seasonal unit til 2025 or so.  Okay besides that we have Fae getting her first alt, which is fine.  However we already have a green armor dragon (Grima), she really should have been colorless also she has armor march but Myrrh has that already.  Most importantly, do you have spare Hectors?  I don't, so besides recently pulling M Grima not too much interest cause I don't know when I'll have DC to give her.  Armors need it so badly.  Well except for the new Ephraim who wants to go away from his allies, and is completely geared towards player phase so the focus should be on that and he comes pretty set to go which is nice for those of us not in Forbes magazine.  Eirika as an armored healer is the spotlight the star of the banner, looks like an amazing support unit with that staff and her C skill.  She comes with dazzling staff, so you just do wrathful refine and you are set!  

On the other hand...armors again.  Halloween was all armors, and now Christmas.  I mean these seem heavily targeted towards whales (Eirika will likely have some ridiculous BST for a staff unit like 170 or 175 too) rather than the general populace.  For the general playerbase they are fairly split on if they like or dislike using armors at all.  However most of them love fliers and don't mind infantry or horses.  

Also 4 Ephraims and 4 Eirikas isn't a problem at all.  We have tons of Fates/Awakening characters now with 4 or more versions.  

All in all I am going to have to go "Bah Humbug" cause my terrible luck trying to get Mia on the Halloween banner, the only unit that really interests me here is Eirika but I am not dropping hundreds and hundreds of orbs into colorless to get nothing again.  

Hopefully the new NY banner is all fliers, but with beast units coming up I am going to be extra careful with my orbs even though it seems we are getting a large amount in the coming weeks.  

 

 

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2 hours ago, Sunsurge said:

Orrrr, you could understand cultural differences more and not be so quick to lose patience in the first place. It's a bit self-centered to think they need to be more communicative to make western players happy. Honestly, Western culture could just stand to be MORE understanding and patient in the first place. Furthermore, even in our culture, companies are NOT that open about what's going on. 

... do you even know, what you're talking about?
For one, the japanese fanbase has about as much patience as any other human in the world. Once a mistake is made though they are much more vocal about it.
The same can be said about the Koreans as well. Don't know about China or Taiwan, probably the same when I look at recent handlings regarding FGO (aka censorship).
Trying to pin dissatisfaction as a purely "western concept" makes you look like a fool.

@Othin
Transparency on the other hand builds trust which in turn keeps player invested in the game.
See it the other way around; if IS didn't announce the RD or BB banner back then these fans might have outright quitted the game once they saw the Adrift banner (and we all know the uproar regarding that one). Rubbing in even more Fates characters doesn't sit well for them, even worse if they have no knowledge about a possible release in the future.
I would rather see that announcement as damage control rather than prematurely causing disapppointment.

To be fair the kind of transparency people are expecting (including myself) is the exception of course. The only one I'm remotely aware of having that kind of transparency is Cygames (who developed GB, SV and DL) who has way more experience with Gacha games and probably know how to adress their fanbase accordingly.
Most companies stay silent, for better or worse.

-----

Anyway, to the banner itself.
No Fates or Awakening. Color me impressed, are we actually moving away from Fates padding? Watch as I eat these words in 2019.

... but of course I'm also staring down on another likely candidate for 180 BST (if not all 3 of them, considering the recent trend of applying Trainee bonus to anyone).
Also Atk Opening makes me upset. Just ... why?

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5 minutes ago, NoirCore said:

but IS is interestingly still using Fjorm as the 4th unit in the banner preview as opposed to Eir

I suspect they're waiting for Sharena to die so they can swap Eir in for her instead.

@Lewyn: I'm amazed too. I wonder how many people got fired for this "oversight".

@Othin: Huh. I can't say I'm happy to see that. I still want Eirika to win, but boy do I feel weird for saying that.

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11 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

Shut your mouths, shut your mouths right now!!

Hey, I actually wanted CYL Eirika at some point! Not sure if I can in good conscience throw all of my support at her this year though because of this. As much as I like red mage Eirika for how much content she's cleared for me, that one is easily the most expendable and unnecessary alt. And probably sabotaged her chances of winning the most

That said, I will still pull for this Eirika because I do like Eirika as a character and as a unit I would like her. But I'm not going to expect to get her because while Heroes has been kind of generous with 5-stars recently for me, it refuses to give me the characters I actually want.

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47 minutes ago, The Priest said:

 

... but of course I'm also staring down on another likely candidate for 180 BST (if not all 3 of them, considering the recent trend of applying Trainee bonus to anyone).
Also Atk Opening makes me upset. Just ... why?

I think the only thing that upsets me about Atk Opening is that it buff the same stat it requires. But i guess i only will have my opinion made about it after seeing the next Openings. Will they all rely on Atk? Or will they each require the stat they will boost?

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The only thing I want is for Festive Siegmund to be available as a weapon for every single lance-wielding Ephraim.  He looks like he REALLY wants to be left alone for Christmas!

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36 minutes ago, eclipse said:

The only thing I want is for Festive Siegmund to be available as a weapon for every single lance-wielding Ephraim.  He looks like he REALLY wants to be left alone for Christmas!

It's a kinda weird situation right now, right?

I mean, Armads doesn't have a refine, so Beserk Armads kinda counts as it. But Siegmund already has one. 

Then again, if we are lucky they will just treat it the same as Aura, Excalibur and their Dark versions.

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9 minutes ago, RexBolt said:

It's a kinda weird situation right now, right?

I mean, Armads doesn't have a refine, so Beserk Armads kinda counts as it. But Siegmund already has one. 

Then again, if we are lucky they will just treat it the same as Aura, Excalibur and their Dark versions.

It's actually closer than that. There's both Berserk Armads and Thunder Armads, but only the first one is available for refinement from the basic one.

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2 minutes ago, Othin said:

It's actually closer than that. There's both Berserk Armads and Thunder Armads, but only the first one is available for refinement from the basic one.

Yes, the same way there's Flame Siegmund and i don't expect it to be refinable into a festive weapon. 

I wonder if Ike will show up with a seasonal version of Ragnell someday, to keep the trend of popular boys who bring their real weapons to the party and use them in all their alts minus their Brave version.

 

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2 hours ago, The Priest said:

... do you even know, what you're talking about?
For one, the japanese fanbase has about as much patience as any other human in the world. Once a mistake is made though they are much more vocal about it.
The same can be said about the Koreans as well. Don't know about China or Taiwan, probably the same when I look at recent handlings regarding FGO (aka censorship).
Trying to pin dissatisfaction as a purely "western concept" makes you look like a fool.

Nobody was trying to pin dissatisfaction as entirely western concept, so calm down. Just from what I see (and the friends I have who are foreign), the lack of patience and desperate need for everything to be detailed and explained (read: entitlement) is something I generally see from my western friends more. Everyone can be (and should be in some cases) dissatisfied about certain aspects of the game or things in general. I don't think being disappointed in poor handling is exclusive to anyone. They've handled things poorly. It's a fact. But maybe I'm just judging it from my friends (which clearly do not represent everyone), but they have tons more patience about the way the game is going and understand developing times/etc. They still complain, but it's generally not about the speed OR a desperate need for the company to tell them everything. They complain, and know their concerns will eventually be addressed if they do it loud enough. Instead of calling people fools, you should probably take a glance in the mirror. Or you know ... read a post fully or ask for clarification. 

-

But onto the topic. I'm thinking if we get enough tickets I might go for Eirika, because it would definitely be helpful to have an armored healer. Definitely won't spend more than 20-ish orbs on it though, but might wait until near the end of the banner run to see all that's going on. But with New Years right around the corner, I'm thinking I want some NY!Takumi/Azura merges, so I might hold off until there's only a couple days left and see how many orbs I have!

 

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4 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

Micaiah winning as a result is the only silver lining to this, though I suspect Camilla and Loki will both get in instead if this alt really does destroy Eirika's chances (partly due to cynicism, but also because they were in the top 5 alongside Eirika).

Meh, people are quite sick of Camilla and Loki is part of the permanent summoning pool. The main reason the OCs ranked so high was because people wanted them playable. That need has been satisfied already. Characters like Micaiah and Nino could end up getting a boost. As for Eirika, she went from having no alts to having 3 alts within the same year. 

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6 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

That's the most painful comparison I've ever heard xD If only alts were as damaging to Eirika's CYL chances as they are for Camilla (i.e. barely, if at all).

Micaiah winning as a result is the only silver lining to this, though I suspect Camilla and Loki will both get in instead if this alt really does destroy Eirika's chances (partly due to cynicism, but also because they were in the top 5 alongside Eirika).

...this is the worst Christmas gift ever - it's certainly the most backhanded one!

But Camilla has one more alt so why do you think it won't reduce Camilla's chances while substantially reducing Eirika's? 

The silver lining I see is this means Eirika is a popular character which is why she got the second highest number of alts regardless of how well she does in CYL or how poorly she does because it is clearly not an accurate representation of popularity. 

Does this mean you're going to save your orbs in protest? 

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5 hours ago, Lewyn said:

Hopefully the new NY banner is all fliers, but with beast units coming up I am going to be extra careful with my orbs even though it seems we are getting a large amount in the coming weeks. 

are you trying to get me to use all my orbs? :p 

1 hour ago, Lord-Zero said:

Meh, people are quite sick of Camilla and Loki is part of the permanent summoning pool. The main reason the OCs ranked so high was because people wanted them playable. That need has been satisfied already. Characters like Micaiah and Nino could end up getting a boost. As for Eirika, she went from having no alts to having 3 alts within the same year. 

gosh, i might have to hide if Camilla got a CYL. 
It wouldn't bug me if it was Eirika. but i could see the salt. 
NIno/Micaiah would make me oh so v. happy. 

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And we are back to whining about Camilla, despite the fact that she's not even on the banner.  Cut it out, it's not healthy, and y'all are annoying Eirika (who IS on the banner).

Edited by eclipse
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Well, alt fatigue is a thing which is something the Renais twins both have in common at the moment and with this particular banner, slipping in other characters that have cases of alt fatigue is hard to avoid. 

Anyway, armored healer...that was unavoidable. All that’s left is an armored refresher and possibly an armored beast unit. As for the Cecilias, I’ll turn both copies into combat manuals and fodder them off if they have some SI value. 

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